Dean750

Multiple Kite Pairs or Teams

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Is there a team out there with each pilot flying at least 2 kites? Just curious. Always wanted to do that just don't know anyone else that flies two kites at once.

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Is there a team out there with each pilot flying at least 2 kites? Just curious. Always wanted to do that just don't know anyone else that flies two kites at once.

I just bought 2 new tech cherry bombs on 75ft spectra 90# lines using two handles from my benson airbow quad kite. and I gotta say it is definitely worth trying. The first day I tried it I was able to keep them both up in a medium wind with only a couple walks of shame. Buy the third day I'm felling quiet comfortable controlling them. It's almost more fun than flying my revs! There aren't any other flyer's in my area so I guess I gotta do myself. Try it, you'll like it!

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I haven't been able to fly for a while. I'm starting to break the rust off.

Unfortunatly, only my MEFM is flyable at the moment. Have to replace 3 rods in my fathers. And since the accident and surgery I can't move my left wrist like I could before. Noticed this Friday when I tried my dual Prism Ions on my 10" Rev handles. Today I put my MEFM up on a Rev handle and switched back and forth. I have come to the conclusion that my current SHORT Rev handles don't have the throw I need to please myself. The Ions take to much input (like 6 to 8") to turn or you over control and they flop and die for the most part. And thier just too fast with enough wind to fly them together.

The MEFM's are a different story though. I'd still rather have a longer throw on the handles. So I guess I gotta come up with an idea for handles.

I wanna trick with two kites and make angle turns not just looped loops. LOL, bit of a perfectionist I am, I am. :crazy:

Would be kick ass I think to get at least 2 ppl, 4 kites together flying as a team competing with the pairs and team classes. It's just getting my handles made and being able to prove that cascades, flic flacs, flat spins, jacobs ladder, roto fades, ground work, tip stabs etc.... can all be done one handed. (Most of it is easier one handed. Well, what I remember from flying my X4I's indoors anyway.)

So just as soon as I can come up with $45 I'll get to work and let you know. Maybe a team could be in the future.

Dean B)

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I haven't been able to fly for a while. I'm starting to break the rust off.

Unfortunatly, only my MEFM is flyable at the moment. Have to replace 3 rods in my fathers. And since the accident and surgery I can't move my left wrist like I could before. Noticed this Friday when I tried my dual Prism Ions on my 10" Rev handles. Today I put my MEFM up on a Rev handle and switched back and forth. I have come to the conclusion that my current SHORT Rev handles don't have the throw I need to please myself. The Ions take to much input (like 6 to 8") to turn or you over control and they flop and die for the most part. And thier just too fast with enough wind to fly them together.

The MEFM's are a different story though. I'd still rather have a longer throw on the handles. So I guess I gotta come up with an idea for handles.

I wanna trick with two kites and make angle turns not just looped loops. LOL, bit of a perfectionist I am, I am. :crazy:

Would be kick ass I think to get at least 2 ppl, 4 kites together flying as a team competing with the pairs and team classes. It's just getting my handles made and being able to prove that cascades, flic flacs, flat spins, jacobs ladder, roto fades, ground work, tip stabs etc.... can all be done one handed. (Most of it is easier one handed. Well, what I remember from flying my X4I's indoors anyway.)

So just as soon as I can come up with $45 I'll get to work and let you know. Maybe a team could be in the future.

Dean B)

You might be interested in this: multiple kites

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Hi Dean,

I have not been able to one handed trick (not that good at two handed anyway) in anything but light wind flying a the smaller 7' version of the kite I normally fly (Gull 8.5) which has an 8 1/2' wingspan. But I do believe that if the handle contained either a spring loaded mechanism or rapid linear actuator that enabled you to get a little more pop from the hand movement it would be feasible to do basic tricks in moderate wind. I had a friend who could only use on of his arms that could axel, tip stab, fade and do a few others by banging his handle on his leg to help him get the extra pop in the line.

If you have any ideas on a mechanical handle and would like help fabricating one let me know. I plan on giving Penny a better one hand rev handle this summer at the Brookings Kite festival here in Oregon.

Gary MacEachern

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Well that was wierd...... :clap; one hell of a typo anyway....

I've noticed I don't have the quickness anymore. Or maybe I'm just outta practice. But with the old standard Rev handles I could axle, cascade, flic flac, flat spin... not a problem. I think it came down to how little touch the kite needs to do it's thing, how much throw you have side to side and how quick you could flick your wrist. I have never tried trickin two kites in anything over 10mph. But I will as soon as I get my fathers M fixed. Mostly I like to fly dual kites in winds of 3 to 10 mph. But as soon as I can I'll be back trying. I really think I need longer handles instead of the 10" Rev handles though.

Dean :P

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I did try shock cord for a while. But eventually it'll stretch. But I guess that comes down to the strength of the cord. I only had the original cords for my MEFM tips. They gave that extra pop. But not everything needs that extra pop, so it kinda limits your ability to do somethings. But like I typed, it may depend on the strength of the cord.

Dean :clap;

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Another thing I've learned is that if the trick needs slack in the line, you have to give more slack than normal to make up for the lack of throw.

Dean :clap;

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Way Cool Dean, my hat's off to anyone that can do even the most basic trick one handed. Just getting a pair of kites to stall and slide takes real effort for me. When you get back into it send me a video I would like to post it on my web site. I'm trying to promote my kite as well as encouraging multiple kite flying. I have a ball flying two and three at a time. The bigger kite really makes a presence in the sky but I must admit that in winds above 10mph they are a bit much for me and I like to drop down to the smaller one.

Again let me know if I can help with handles, I have access to scrap aluminum bar and plate and can get things welded together.

Gary MacEachern

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You know, it's really been a while since I've been able to get the M's up on my Rev handles. My left wrist doesn't quiet flic like it used to due to the whole arm being broke. ;) I do think I need to really practice. But I think longer handles will be the key. I'm curious about the Gull. Think it's real pretty. But how light is the touch? The key to tricking with dual kites is 4 to 6 inches of QUICK throw to do it's thing in my experience. I started flying 2 X4I's indoors. Course you could do anything with those on 18' lines. The MEFM's really made me feel special though. But outside of the MEFM I don't have alot of experience. I really wanted to (if I'd of bought one too) fly the MEFM Maxi's. Almost 11 feet across. Not trickable, but they were BIG and demanded attention. One handed for me challenged my two handed precision. Even with the M.

I'm trying everything I can to get to Lincoln City this month. With any luck since I'm already working on it I'll be in Brookings this year too.

Dean :blink:

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You know, it's really been a while since I've been able to get the M's up on my Rev handles. My left wrist doesn't quiet flic like it used to due to the whole arm being broke. :blink: I do think I need to really practice. But I think longer handles will be the key. I'm curious about the Gull. Think it's real pretty. But how light is the touch? The key to tricking with dual kites is 4 to 6 inches of QUICK throw to do it's thing in my experience. I started flying 2 X4I's indoors. Course you could do anything with those on 18' lines. The MEFM's really made me feel special though. But outside of the MEFM I don't have alot of experience. I really wanted to (if I'd of bought one too) fly the MEFM Maxi's. Almost 11 feet across. Not trickable, but they were BIG and demanded attention. One handed for me challenged my two handed precision. Even with the M.

I'm trying everything I can to get to Lincoln City this month. With any luck since I'm already working on it I'll be in Brookings this year too.

Dean B)

Hi Dean...

Heal fellow kite-kook!!! :P

I am stil wearing my hand brace from Carpel (or is that CAR-POOL ) :huh: tunnel surgery last week.

hoping for some light wind so that I can get out to the Purdy Spit with one of my favorite low wind kites..The little Tribal HQ Shadow..(fun kite that does the wackiest slack line stuff that could even re-write Lam's book. Can you imagine just what he and Johnny B could do with this silly little 3/4 sized freebeestyler? ;)

post-3459-1213305464_thumb.jpg

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I hope you feel better soon. Not flying cause of injury sucks. I feel ya.

Dean B)

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You know, it's really been a while since I've been able to get the M's up on my Rev handles. My left wrist doesn't quiet flic like it used to due to the whole arm being broke. ;) I do think I need to really practice. But I think longer handles will be the key. I'm curious about the Gull. Think it's real pretty. But how light is the touch? The key to tricking with dual kites is 4 to 6 inches of QUICK throw to do it's thing in my experience. I started flying 2 X4I's indoors. Course you could do anything with those on 18' lines. The MEFM's really made me feel special though. But outside of the MEFM I don't have alot of experience. I really wanted to (if I'd of bought one too) fly the MEFM Maxi's. Almost 11 feet across. Not trickable, but they were BIG and demanded attention. One handed for me challenged my two handed precision. Even with the M.

I'm trying everything I can to get to Lincoln City this month. With any luck since I'm already working on it I'll be in Brookings this year too.

Dean B)

Hi Dean,

I don't know if we will get to Lincoln City, but if we do you can try out the kites; if not perhaps we will see you in Brookings. I plan on making a video of Al Stroh flying the UL version of the smaller Gull. He likes to fly it and will do so at the Brookings festival as he has done so for the past few years. I'm unfamilar to Herb Weldon's Synchro but Al compares the UL to Herb's indoor version of that kite. The Smaller kite has just under a seven foot wingspan (tip to tip) and other than that it's the same kite as the Gull 8.5. If you e-mail me I will forward you Al's email and he'll be glad to elaborate on the kites performance.

That being said I was not a trick flier when I designed the kite and I'm still not. It will do the basic tricks but if you want a vortex, yo-yo and others like that then you will be better off with one of Lam Hoc's kites. If you want a ballet and precision kite that you can accent your routeen with axels, coin toss, tip stab, slide, flic flac, cascade, fade ect then the Gull 7.0 will work fine. I do plan on developing an active bridal to see if I can get it to be a little more radical and still maintain it's original characteristics but if not I may bring back a earlier design that has a higher aspect and makes me look like I can trick. If I do though it will definitely have an active bridal.

So getting back to your question on throw, the UL in light wind does not need much at all and works good with a light touch, the standard does too but not in my hands. As far as quick throw goes, their was a guy that used to live around here that did more just by giving the lines slack at the right time than I can by snapping them so go figure. I do know that JD Fabish loved the kite when he first starting to get serious about flying but put it aside when getting serious about tricking.

Hope this helps.

Gary MacEachern

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Gary, I would love to try your Gull's out. They're so pretty. My MEFM is old school. But I'm learning that some tricks take a little more input compared to newer trick kites. As for the dual kite trickin. I have been playing around a little and have noticed, 1, I don't have the wrist movment anymore, 2, my physical strength isn't what it was when I was flying before my car accident. And my Rev handles aren't anywhere near long enough. I'll get back to you on the throw thing. I'm laid too far back on the bridle settings right now to really say. It may be that I can only do my thing in very light winds. Like I said before, I'm a 0 to 6 mph flier before the accident.

Lately all I've had here is 10 to 15 mph winds. So I'm learning to trick in higher winds.

I have ALWAYS been a precise pilot. And I've noticed in watching live or on video that multiple kite flyers really don't fly angles. Am I correct on that? Just curious, because I know a person could fly 2 kites and compete at the world level of compition in the pairs class. For that matter, 2 or 3 people could come together and compete in team flying at the world class level. Just a thought that I think alot about. ;)

Dean B)

P.S. I don't know if I'll have the gas money to make it to Lincoln City :confused!: But I can tell you I WILL be in Brookings.

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I have ALWAYS been a precise pilot. And I've noticed in watching live or on video that multiple kite flyers really don't fly angles. Am I correct on that? Just curious, because I know a person could fly 2 kites and compete at the world level of compition in the pairs class. For that matter, 2 or 3 people could come together and compete in team flying at the world class level. Just a thought that I think alot about. ;)

Dean B)

If you mean by angles, squares and triangles I don't see why not. I'm working on my squares and other angles now. I have a new video on youtube of me learning to fly my 2 cherry bombs. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2N2Ue1iXTns. I've been flying 2 kites for about 2 weeks and am 62 years old so I'm sure you younger fellows could do much better B)

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Thats a cool video TonyCarl, wish I had a camera. Posting a vid would be so much easier than figuring out how to explain things.

When I get my fathers M fixed I'll be working on these... http://www.aka.kite.org/?iskrb_compfigs.html

I've watched a few of Ray Bethal, Gary MacEachern and others and have tried to compare my flying style to thiers. I seem to fly a little more square than what I've seen so far. Flying 3 kites seems to me like it would be REALLY hard to follow the compfigs from above. But 2 kites I don't think would be as hard. Keeping the kites together when flying isn't as difficult as say having each kite in different areas of the window mirroring each other. By mirroring I mean the same but oppisite. ;) I hope that comes out the way I meant it. Flying that way in a team would only drive the difficulty level up a little. B) I'd like to give it a shot once I get a little practice.

Dean B)

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But I can tell you I WILL be in Brookings.

Hi Dean,

That's great, I look forward to meeting you and putting a set of kites in your hands to try out. I will be at the field by early afternoon Friday (maby sooner if I can get the whole day off work).

One thing I need to do is get more video, finding someone to hand my camera to when flying is kind of a hassle but AL Stroh has promised he will shoot some footage of me this summer. As far as square routeens go (that tony mentioned) I can do them pretty good with the smaller kite flying three (great with two).

Flying the larger kite has strengthened my hands; I stop flying the 8.5 one handed when it stays above 8mph. This past weekend the wind in Crescent City CA was about 12-15mph all day Saturday. Anyway, I had not flown the 7.0 set since last fall and I was very pleased with my ability to square the corners this weekend.

One thing I'm working on with three is flying a figure eight that is smooth and symmetrical with the kites evenly staggered in the figure. That is one at the top of the loop on each side and one crossing the middle on the diagonal. I can do it ok, but not as smooth as I would like to. The next step in this is squaring the eight, with each kite one leg behind the other, this I'm not so good at yet. The other figure I like to practice is a weave where you fly two opposing figure eights with two kites going to one side, the third going to the other and crossing in the middle with the single kite passing between the pair. I use even line sets and sometimes, well lets just say I fare better than the kites especially when making the return pass from my weak side.

All of this should end up on my web site by the fall.

Again, looking forward to meeting you and hope your arm heals well.

Gary MacEachern

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I've been flying 2 kites for about 2 weeks and am 62 years old so I'm sure you younger fellows could do much better ;)

Hi Tony,

That was great, but believe me brother we are not so different in age. I guess like you I should set my camera up on a tripod and have at it. Good job.

I can see by the way that the kites meet in the middle that you are already working on good symmetry. keep it up. If you have a web site I will post a link to it. Let me know if you would like a link of your video on my site.

Keeping the same thread with what Dean posted, the figures he has listed are quite a handful. I have a hard time with the single kite steps DI 13 and with DI 18 square cuts, I always seem to miss the last 2 turns so as you can imagine I don't get the pair DP 16 square cuts very good at all. I can however do most of the other pairs figures ok with the exception of circles over diamonds, the last two turns on that one are still very rounded. I have not practiced them very much but I think next summer I will.

Gary MacEachern

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If flying multiple kites were easy EVERYONE would be doing it. Most who try it fly round most of the time. Flying two kites seprate from each other is a real test of skill, in not just attention but reaction. 3 kites almost seems insane. Anyone that can turn a 90 degree angle or more with the hips or chest is really getting into what they are doing. I hope to try it some day. ;) For now, I want to be able to make myself feel really good just flying 2 kites at once. Flying the compfigs with the kites together I think I'll get back to pretty quick. Mirroring I'm hoping comes back soon.

I tried flying 2 OLD Prism Ions a couple of weeks ago. B) I never flew the two when I could and did fly dual kites. Don't know why I even tried B) Way to fast, don't turn real tight, and if they do you over did the control and they flop. I did manage to not run one kite through with the other on the flop :w00t: I was on 150# line in about 12 mph winds. Thats the wrong set up for flying one, let alone the wrong set up for the first attempt returning to 2 :P

I can't wait to get back to it, hope to see MORE vids from the both of you. You have both stoked my drive. Thank you.

Dean

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A question just came to mind, when turning angles, do you two push or pull turn? Just curious, cause I pull on round turns and push on the angles. Pushing allows the kite to do most of the work saving you from fatigue? Just curious.

I also, except for light wind step forward on angle turns. Again, it releases some of the pull and makes the turn a little easier to control. Less over steer. Sorry, I'm sure you guys already know this. I'm a bit of a perfectionist with a problem sometimes of being overly competitive. ;)

Dean B)

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Gary, I don't have a web site but I believe you can link my stuff on you tube to your web site. I'd like to see more videos of you flying. What kites and line length are you using? The trouble with a camera on a tripod (I'm just using the video feature on my digital camera) is getting most of the flying window in view, so I try to fly in a smaller window. Also hard to keep centered (slight wind direction changes). I'm trying to practice more mirror image and crossing line stuff, and trying to get up the nerve to try a complete wrap. I think it's so cool to fly and watch fly 2 or more kites flying. In fact I find myself flying my 2 kites more than I do My revs.

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Hey Tony,

Just curious since you mentioned wraps. Have you attempted refueling yet?

As for wraps, after watching you fly I wouldn't worry about putting wraps in the lines. Your kites don't look like they are struggling to fly.

If your worried about it, walk back as the kites are going up during the wrap and forwords as they go down. Speed control in my opinion will

not only make your angles and round moves easier and prettier, but it'll help you in the stamina department.

Also, if you attempt your first wraps as I did (refueling) you'll get over the wrap fear a little quicker. The lead kite does just that and leads the follower. Might want to have the second kite on slightly shorter lines though. 5 feet difference is a good number. That way your lines don't really change the flight charicteristics (sorry for the typo) of either kite. Other wise your going to have one hand fully extended and one at your hip or behind you.

Just a tip.

Dean ;)

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Another question is.... Are you going to be able to make it to Brookings this year Tony? If so, maybe the 3 of us could fly together. Basic follow the leader, nothing real hard unless we 3 click. B) Anything is possible. Specially if Gary has 6 of each. The 8.5 and the 7.0??????? Theres a thought. B)

Dean :w00t:

Sorry Gary ;)

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