Hedgewarden

Flat on the ground, you say Duane....hmmm. The first time my EXP went flat on the ground against my will was when I broke the leading edge spar - I did not seat it completely over the center section - a grain of sand made it stick and I got impatient to fly. The second time my EXP went flat was when I broke a leading edge race rod - got a wing flip near the ground and spun into the ground, I think. I happened rather fast, then I saw the crippled wing and crumpled kite. The third and final time my kite went flat was my new 1.5 mid-vent. In gusty winds, I flew it to the edge of the wind window as the window was collapsing. The kite floated leading edge down from high to the ground with nothing I could do, the lines were completely slack. No damage tho. Rather interesting experience, actually. So, although I briefly wondered about launching from a flat position, I have not had the occasion to yet. I suspect in one or two more sessions with your Rev, you will find the question academic also.

This will make TK the queen of Kitelandia, right? Congratulations to all us citizens of Kitelandia. Well, seems appropriate. And best wishes for your life together.

I have not examined a Shadow - love looking at pix of them tho. But I do have a number of HQ kites, and they usually have a knotted pig-tail for the upper bridle nose adjustment. Is that not part of the Shadow? Or did you run out of adjustment range? Curious as much as suggesting...

OH JUST GREAT! Dodd Gross does not use line stakes. JB does not figure eight his lines. I'm going to have to go back to my "Pirate Super Sport Fun Flying Kite" with two winder-handles and start learning all over again. In addition - I'm starting to connect with my Rev, so I do not need the Soul. Nope. Not at all.

Hmmpph...well, if you must know: I gave away an XL Sport 70 to a family member. A super introduction to sport kite flying - largish, slowish, pretty decent flying characteristics for the price!! He spent a whole day flying it, which works out to a price of about $2/hr - great bargain. Of course, if you get serious you quickly move beyond (and give it to a friend/relative). If not, no big $ lost. My recommendation for the inquisitive "I want to try a sport kite - what should I get." Sold a Hornet - seemed redundant to the more capable Silver Fox and HQ Gallego I later acquired. The Hornet was my first full size kite - and taught me about speed control and the meaning of precision. Gave away an HQ Floater because I had two, and to complete the Hornet deal. Gave away an Addiction because I had snagged 4 (FOUR!) at super prices on eBay - figuring after finding the first kite was a winner that they would make good "flying together" or gift kites. (Yeah - I have one more I might give away to a very close family member.) Other than that, all the way too many kites in my stable still have a role to play for me or my wife. Those I have not flown for a while, when I return to them teach me more. I do not have any competition level kites yet. The top of my stable are HQ Gallego and HQ Phoenix Supreme, and a full set of Silver Foxes 2.5. Well, and also a Nighthawk - definitely one of my favorites. Those are all going to stay with me for some time.

Hi Penny, I saved this thread to study it later. Finally got back to it! Make of that what you will. Cool theory. The physics details would be very complicated, so not likely a good approach to justify the theory. Observed correlations could lend support, but not prove the theory. But that just means your mind is running ahead of the known universe. Keep questioning. Glad to finally meet you at WSIKF.

My last word... 5 - 6 mph winds this afternoon, smooth SW winds on the beach. Swapped the EXP stock frame for the race frame. I've never gotten the EXP in the air in less than around 10 (8 maybe?) mph, so I was not optimistic, only hopeful. WOW - the baby flew as well as I could pilot!! No need for pumping and backing (light wind techniques I'm too old or lazy to do.) That definitely doubles the days I can play with baby. Excellent advice, ya all. Good winds.

Okay, okay... and thanks for all the advice. Watched the mega-fly in the morning - 30 kites or so. No, I am not going to join them - with my less than novice skills, there would only be 15 kites remaining after my out-of-control maneuvers. Maybe after my second 4 hours of flight time, I could be the odd EXP in the batch of B's and Zens. JB was too busy - almost got a chance to say hi. Ben was very helpful. Seconded the idea of race frame, and shared a tip or two. Thanks also to Dave Bradley, and a few others whose names I missed. And of course the local "drug" dealer working out of the back of the unmarked truck - Theresa had a race frame set ready for me. By far the lowest cost improvement providing the best future flexibility. Waiting for some winds now.

Thanks for the ideas, everyone. The WA beach is throwing a lot of 20 mph+ winds, and 4 mph- winds at us. At home, we are lucky to get any wind that isn't just plain crazy (swirly, lumpy, and frequently fading to zero.) Right now, a SUL would get more use than a vented, I think. Actually, on my first really good day with the EXP (two days ago) - I executed several large smooth-ish circles. I checked the wind afterward and it was 14 to 18 mph - exceeding the EXP's rated 15 mph. Winds of 6 mph and less leave me completely frustrated. That is why the SUL seems attractive as the next step - and not as expensive as a B with race frames. I don't need to replace the EXP as long as it flies better than the pilot. Today at WSIKF the wind varied from almost non-existent to a 2 hour moderately heavy back to almost none. I-Quad, of course, still put on an impressive show - but I don't know which models they were using, they did not look like B's, unless they are a new design. I'll corner JB on the field and make him lend me his kite. (just kidding!) If the winds are low again tomorrow, I'll try to approach some of the fliers.

Folks, all experts: Well, anyone more experienced than I... I broke down and bought a Rev EXP at Lincoln City this year. Great price with the show discount - could not pass it up. Now there are several factors pushing me to buy my second Rev. This is my first Rev experience, although I have a few hours on my Spirit Quad. 1. I love the way the EXP flies in above 8 mph winds. Below that (6 mph maybe?), it doesn't want to play with me. 2. I managed several acceptably smooth circles today, and some nice sideways hovers - in bumpy winds around 13-16 mph. We're down to see WSIKF 2009 this week - but using time between the "must see" events to fly around Ocean Park. 3. There is an appealing eBay lot for an 1.5 SUL. Obviously the 1.5 is a step up from the EXP. And it should fill the lower wind speed gap. Maybe? Sure - buy the B series pro with race frames to get everything. But let's talk bang-for-buck for a novice quad flier. I can use the handles and line set from the EXP for the 1.5 SUL to get started. I can add (say) 50# line set later to stretch a little lower. And some day when I can fly better than the EXP (if that ever happens!), we can get the serious B kites. So, thoughts on a beginner's stable of EXP plus 1.5 SUL? Hey, thanks in advance guys (incl. gals - love everything I've seen you do, Penny and Amy!).

Aha! There's a decent use for that "blue stuff". I personally don't like it - the braiding makes the lines feel "notchy" when they are wrapped just a few times. I got it at bargain 1/2 price, but since I'd rather not use it for line-sets, it was not a great bargain. Just a personal opinion - I'm sure other people have different opinions.

Favorite - I will probably die if my HQ Gallego ever expires. This kite anticipates everything I want it to do, in the realm of ballet. Also much loved - Premier Nighthawk and Addiction. The Addiction taught me how to break spars (and replace them). There is no safety release on the spine, so an untimely wind gust and slow correction response can shatter the spine on a nose dive into either earth or sand. Really, tho, a great fun flier for the price. The Nighthawk is helping me learn slack line. It's a lot more forgiving than I am. Nicer looking too. My Silver Foxes are still enjoyable - but they seem slow compared to the others. They may have the best precision of the trickable kites.

Way wow, John. Well, I broke down and added a Rev to my dual collection at Lincoln City. Great deal - got to try one and get 15% off a very good price. Next time I find decent winds, I'm definitely going to duplicate your B-Pro demo on my EXP. So, I now officially have one foot in the dark side. Here is my take on the differences. Dual lines are like airplanes - you have to move forward (or stall), but the the basics of graceful movements are inherent in the wind. Quads are like helicopters - capable of movements impossible in airplanes, but no helicopter will ever compare to the power and grace of the Blue Angels. I want to fly both to the limits of my ability. Again, way wow. Like a helicopter doing a barrel roll (I've seen it on video) - impossible.

John, OK , I've tried it. "e2" and "e3" give no match. :confused!: "E3" and "E2" give respectively no match, and flood control. ... Flood control "Titles only": no match (on E2). "Fox" and "fox" give no match and flood control. Again no match on "Titles only" "Silver" and "silver" give different results. But you can get a lot of hits with "silver fox" in the title - matches on "silver" that "fox" did not find. Conclusions: 1. 2 and 3 letter searches are not working. 2. Search is case sensitive. Searches should, by default, be for words, so 2 or three letter words such as "E2" or "Fox" should cause no problem. Of course, "no" should be a "no no", etc. Case sensitivity is not expected by default - us Googlers get confused by cases As do many posters who have not discovered the shift key. Hmm, this creaky old software engineer says the search function need serious redesign. Searches with too many hits can simply terminate after the first 50 (or some reasonable number) thus not consuming too much server. I do realize that you cannot provide the server power of Google or Yahoo. Limits are fine, but I don't think the best ergonomic limits have been implemented, and they don't seem to work anyway. Visually attractive, topically enticing, many thanks for the forum John. Don't take this as a harsh criticism.

JB, I think this problem was in the previous forum incarnation, Ya can't search on terms less than 4 letters! I want to find E3, SF, lots of other short words - plenty unique, and not like "and" and "not". Besides, the message implies it already has a list of unsearchable terms - I assume those that flood the response. Fixable? Just suggesting.

I cannot comment on the others, but the Silver Fox UL does not fly well in lower winds, as it comes from the factory. I, however, have not tried removing the tail weight and the upper spreader. I have seen other posts describing that, and it probably would bring the lower wind range down substantially. Although the SF UL has not flown well for me in winds under 5-7 MPH (estimated), in higher winds it flies extremely well - just like the standard but in slightly lower winds. Also consider this 67 year-old non-athletic body does not back-peddle well. I look forward to trying again with the upper spreader and weight removed, if we ever get decent winds again. Summary: SF UL very nice kite, but considerable effort or some adjustments needed for true UL flight range. In light winds, 75 to 90 lb lines should be sufficient, if you already have those. As for those wind range ratings, they seem to apply only to expert athletic fliers. Like gas mileage on cars, use them only for comparison.

More AM winds where? I'm 2 years into this kite thing, and in Chehalis-Centralia, the winds are rarely usable. Recently purchased land on Long Beach Peninsula - is your Tsunami theory predicting a disaster? Oh my, Oh my - bore us.

First call - MINE, MINE, MINE! Whot? That's not the way it works? BTW, is there an unnamed sponsor - or is this entirely Kitelife funded?

Yeah. When we were starting, we (I and wife) asked Andy at Ocean Shores Kites for something like a wind-sock. He said he had none, but he disappeared into the backroom and came back shortly with a fiberglass spar and a multi-ribbon streamer attached to one end with a swivel, the other end sharpened, that he built on the spot. Charged us almost nothing! Now, with a little more experience, I find I do not NEED it as a wind indicator. I just equalize the wind on the back of my two ears, and I'm facing very close to down wind. I splurged on a wind-speed meter so I could calibrate my own estimates. However, when I take my bag-o-kites to the beach, and plop it down at the dunes edge or driftwood edge, I plant the wind indicator by the bag so that: 1. I can keep an eye on my stuff more easily, 2. I feel it tells passers-by that the bag is not abandoned. 3. It is still useful for indicating the direction and approx speed of the wind. If the wind direction shifts. I often don't notice it while flying. If you wish to duplicate this indicator, I can pull it out and more carefully describe it. It works very well for direction and approx. wind speed, and it looks cool IMO.

Hmm, Jon, 20 years ago, the noise was an important part of a sports kite! See "The Stunt Kite Book" by Fujino & Ruhe, 1989 Good luck on the mods. I believe, the noise dissipates energy, so slows the kite in higher winds. Let us know if the handling changes (the secrets of the Kite Designer Guild are discovered?) The quietest kite I've owned I think was a Hornet - tremendous precision but not much trickability. Modest pull until the wind picked up to 20 mph - then scared the bejabbers out of this newb. Speaking of 20 mph winds - today I got about 20 min of air-time . Gusty winds, so I flew my Yin-Yang. In rather uncooperative winds, I axeled once on the left, and once on the right wind window edge. That was 100% of the attempts (I didn't try when I felt the set-up was wrong.) - a personal best under less than ideal conditions ( ) That was the first time I axeled the Yin-Yang without wrapping a tip! The Yin-Yang was "screaming" when the wind was above 15 mph (est.). That and the split sail does seem to help mitigate gusty winds. Any-hoo, Jon, please let us know if taming the noise affects the handling.

I thought all kites have two lines. One to turn right, one to turn left. What else is there? Waiting with bated breath..............