Dan

Milking the Breeze - Dual Line

11 posts in this topic

John, in your "Milking the Breeze" articles, you gave the line length and kite you used for the quad article, but not the dual line article. I was hoping you could tell us what equipment you tend to use in light/no wind situations. I've been using a 50# x 50' lineset and a ZeroStar and Sano SSL, but was thinking of trying longer lines after reading some posts on GWTW. I know lineset strengths and lengths seem to be personal preference a lot of times, but I was curious what your preference is. I haven't had the easiest time keeping my kites up, but that's probably more about skill than anything else.

Everyone else feel free to respond too.

Thanks,

Dan

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Even on dual line, I prefer 100' or more... Maximum of 125'.

Simple reason, my kite can travel higher (longer lines), enabling me to gain more ground. :)

110' of 50# is divine for just about anyone, with the light wind techniques applied.

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Hey there...

I can see where John is going with his theory... I have both 50' and 75' 50# lines, and have found the same thing that John was describing, with my 75' lines, I can gain back ground quicker, and have more time to fly inbetween the ground gaining excercise. I thought by going longer, I would tend to drag down the kite more, but I will try using even longer 50# lines as he suggests.

I'd bet having a good light wind kite would really help, too, I have an HQ 'Floater' that is kind of cheap and twitchy. I have also found that an oversize kite flies well in very little breeze. With 1-3mph I like to fly my Firestorm (10' wingspan) with 90# lines. It's super slow-mo style flying, but it doesn't require the constant back and fourth ground gaining excercise.

~Rob.

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Nice, thanks guys! I'm excited to give it a shot.

~Dan

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I've seen a few videos with guys pumping the kite up into the sky. Do any of you do that as well, or is slow and steady pressure a better way to go?

~Dan

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Steady, deep rowing to gain altitude is best... The quick pumping is often self-defeating due to the quick release after each pump.

Big deep pump back, then easy (slow) release, walking away from your hands. :)

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I find that the quick pumping action makes the kite tend to flip into a backflip position, especially when you have the bridle adjusted for light wind. I'm sure once you become one with the kite, there's a place for quick, jerky tugs on the line, but I try to do everything slow and steady so nothing gets too far out of control. Almost all of my abrubt inputs result in too much response from the kite, requiring compensation in the oposite direction, kind of like driving on ice.

I must say that I still don't fly too well in low wind, but I blame my low quality light wind kite for my slow progress. On the other hand, I'm sure the more advanced flyers could make my Floater kite do things I never imagined possible.

~Rob.

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Are any of these techniques modified for honest to goodness no wind outdoor flying? Or still keep the lines long and the techniques the same? There have been just some dead still evenings around here.

Kind of off topic, but I'd love to hear your thoughts on line length for any situation, John. Do you keep it over 100' for tricking, competition, and just goofing around?

~Dan

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well for no winds i fly short lines like i would indoors i have 13 15 20 30 foot sets for those days the best i use for still air are the 20 foot set outside . indoors i go with the shorter sets as for the smaller space i have to fly if you have a breeze 2 mph to 5 mph then you can use 50 or 75 feet lines

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I fly a Benson Innerspace outdoors constantly in no-wind situations. Bout the shortest lines I care to fly on is about 45', I usually fly on (and prefer) 75' or longer. I don't care for the shorter lines, the kite snaps around much to fast and it is difficult to get the kite locked into its wind where the kite flies smooth and controllable. Kinda hard to say exactly what this is but when you "feel" it you will know what I am talking about. Longer lines allow the kite to lock into its own wind and lets you "fly" the kite more than just yank it around. With the Innerspace I can fly the kite in no wind with barely having to walk backwards at all - maybe one or two steps to get the kite to climb to zenith. Like John says, long firm sweeping strokes gets the kite up in the air easy. It is super easy to get your ground back with the glide on longer lines. I can usually make up tons more ground than I lose with the longer lines. Shorter lines seem to make it harder to make up ground. Up-n-overs are a little easier on shorter lines, especially if you really yank the kite around hard right before the apex. Pulling 360's are smooth and locked in solid on longer lines and you just have to walk slowly around in a smaller circle. On shorter lines I find I have to walk faster and the circle is much larger....almost running if the wind happens to pick up a mile/hour or so. I found that the Innerspace goes up when everything else wont, it has become my favorite indoor (although I primarily use it outdoors). It will go up even when my Vapor won't.

The most important lesson I learned when I was learning to fly the Innerspace was to not let the lines go slack at all. Arm movements have to be short, very slow and smoooooooooth. If you pull to much to quickly then you dump all the wind (0 wind that is) out of the kite and you'll lose it. Keep both lines with "just the right amount" of tension on them when you fly and it will start to click. If one line goes slack you're pulling to hard and too much.

When I first started I thought light wind flying was not for me. I am glad that I stuck with it because it has turned uncountable irritating days of not being able to fly into some of the best flying I have had.

Hope this helps.

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I almost never use anything under 110' for dual, quad, tricking or otherwise... Bottom line, I like having the extra space in the sky.

Only time I'll use less is if my actual flying space is limited and I need to cut down. ;)

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