kitetime Posted October 3, 2007 Report Share Posted October 3, 2007 Hi, I thought this was a better fit in beginner then in Trick flying, since this is hopefully very basic info. I just ordered a Prism Quantum kite as my first decent kite. I am used to placing the kite face down with the string laid out, and then running to the end of the string and picking it up and tugging on it to get it up in the air. Of course this has to be done before the wind just picks the kite up on its own. Is there a better way that is easy to do by one person? Also what are the tricks, if any, for getting the kite back in the air after having made a unplanned landing? I assume the ktie could be face down, face up, and pointing towards you or away, and any combination in between. PS Tried searching the forum but got an error message... Thanks, Keith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMPVW73 Posted October 3, 2007 Report Share Posted October 3, 2007 I just lay the kite on its back nose away, attach the lines, walk them out then give them a tug and the kite stands up and takes off. If the kite is still powered by the wind with a leading edge on the ground, pull one line to rock it onto the other edge and hopefully over to upright possition. It sometimes takes a while going back and forth if the wind is strong. The face down nose away is a little harder. On this one you want to do what I think is called a "reverse launch rollout". Give the lines a quick tug and the kite will flip up off the ground, pull one line to do a quick turn and your back in the air. It is worth taking the time to practice doing this and learning to get you kite to land in this possition if you cant land on wingtips. If the rollout part fails you just do the first method. Face down nose towards you is very difficult and I've only succesfully done it twice. Do a short fast tug on the lines and the nose will lift a little bit, immediately follow with a pull and hopefully you will get some air under it and take off. I think this works better on sand. Dont spend large amounts of time trying this over and oer because its hard on the leading edge sleaves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandpa Posted October 3, 2007 Report Share Posted October 3, 2007 I take the easy way out for the first launch... Put a stake in the ground, whatever you can push in a screwdriver works, loop your straps or handles over the stake. Walk the lines out and connect to your kite. Stand it up with nose leaning away from you. The kite's nose not yours Slip the handles off the stake... put stake in pocket... I loose more stakes that way. Take a half step back to stand your kite up and tug. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
windofchange Posted October 3, 2007 Report Share Posted October 3, 2007 I would suggest looking at some of the tutorials they have listed on the Prism Kites Website. It shows a couple of the basics like the Cartwheel and such. The Prism Freestyle Pilot DVD is awesome and shows how to do all of the ground recoveries. Here is a link to the Prism Site: Prism Kites Website Hope this helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baloo Posted October 4, 2007 Report Share Posted October 4, 2007 Good suggestion Kent. The Freestyle DVD is easy to understand and I have managed to put it on my iPod thingy so can take it to the field with me. It comes with a handy booklet as well. You dont need to own a Prism. You can buy it on its own. Money well invested IMHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitetime Posted October 4, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 4, 2007 Very good information here, exactly what I was looking for. That cartwell looks sweet, but I am guessing it is much harder then it looks. Hopefully I won't get a face down nose towards me landing, or it seems I will be doing the walk of shame... Thank you all, now I have some things to try and to practice. I am sure I will have to reference back as I will probably miss some key element to make it work in the field. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syruss Posted October 4, 2007 Report Share Posted October 4, 2007 Don't worry about that. As soon as you master all of those techniques then you will probably move on to a quad line and start back at square one. Everyone has had to do this and there is no way to start out knowing all of this. It is skill, feel of the lines, intuition and sometimes some luck. As you get better you will need less of the luck though. Then you get to like the iQuaders and Penny and it becomes more a part of their being, the same as breathing. It also helps a LOT to have someone that can show you these things. I still struggle with that as I haven't had but about an hour working with someone, the rest is watch and try and try and try and try.... For me it's just fun to fly even if I have to do the walk of shame. And I have seen some of the very best do it at times also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobB Posted October 4, 2007 Report Share Posted October 4, 2007 Hey KT... I use the screwdriver trick for the solo launches as described above. Couldn't be easier than that. The suggestion of waiting until you have a 10mph day is also a good one. To much wind or too little wind will just make you frustrated. It's not worth it, trust me. The exercise of unwinding lines, assembling the kite and trying to fly in too little wind, only to be followed by winding the lines back up and packing the kite back up with no flight time in between is unbelievably frustrating. May as well not even get started. Too much wind and ground recoveries both end up with the same result. Broken kite. I have learned how to do all ground recoveries except nose down towards you. After breaking countless times... If you don't have a spare kite in the bag, the walk of shame isn't as bad as a broken kite. Also, I would suggest to find some spare parts before you break for the first time. It usually takes at least a week to get spare parts, and that week WILL have the best wind you've seen in a long time. There aren't any kite stores within 100 miles of me that carry spare parts, so my only option is to order them online. ~Rob. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
windofchange Posted October 4, 2007 Report Share Posted October 4, 2007 The cartwheel is very simple to do and is the most common way of righting your kite after crashing. One thing that the video doesn't show you is that you will always want to cartwheel towards the center of the window. You can rock your kite back and forth on it's nose so that the nose of the kite is pointing towards the center. Just lightly tug/tap pull on the top wing and it will rock back and forth. To do the cartwheel, give a firm long stroke of the top wing while giving a little slack to the bottom wing and it should rock right over to the flying position. The firmness of your pull will depend on the kite. A couple tries and you should have the strength down pretty good. This works nearly 99% of the time. If the kite lands nose away from you, belly down then you can get the kite into the cartwheel position by slowly tugging on one of the lines. A couple short tugs should lift one side of the kite off the ground and be ready for the cartwheel. The DVD shows you how to relaunch your kite in every possible way. The only one that I don't recommend is the "Dead Launch" and that is the one that has been discussed earlier. Belly down, nose pointing towards you. I have only been able to get this launch to work a couple of times and don't like putting that much stress/dragging on my kites so whenever this happens I just do the walk of shame and flip the kite over onto its back again. I call it my "exercise time". If you find that you are doing the walk of shame way too much (this happens when you are trying to master a new trick), shorter lines helps make the walk much faster and less of a bother. Learning the other launch methods will get you a ton more air time and a lot less walk time!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sky fish Posted October 5, 2007 Report Share Posted October 5, 2007 Good suggestion Kent. The Freestyle DVD is easy to understand and I have managed to put it on my iPod thingy so can take it to the field with me. It comes with a handy booklet as well.You dont need to own a Prism. You can buy it on its own. Money well invested IMHO. Baloo how did you get that on your Ipod?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baloo Posted October 5, 2007 Report Share Posted October 5, 2007 I had to convert the file. Same as I did with the JB DVD that comes with the B series kites. No sure what I used now. Could probably find out. It was a bit "trial and error" though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitetime Posted October 8, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 8, 2007 Thanks for all the advice. I didn't get a chance to try it yet, as UPS has delayed my package from Friday last week to Tuesday this week... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John F Posted October 9, 2007 Report Share Posted October 9, 2007 A good way to setup is to attach the lines to your kite then hold the kite up right and roll it such that the lines come out under the kite over the trailing edge and then set the kite on the ground belly down nose towards you and the wind. Your lines are coming from under the kite over the trailing edge towards you. Now unwind your line. Your kite will not take off from this position since it is nose toward the wind belly down. Now when you pull on the lines the will roll over the nose or leading edge into the launch position. I have started using this setup technique over the past month and it has been 100% sucessful. I think the only way you could get an unintentional launch is to have the wind shift direction by 180 deg. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ant man Posted October 9, 2007 Report Share Posted October 9, 2007 i too am with the screwdriver trick onli i use a golf ball stake Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitetime Posted October 10, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 I will be at the beach, so I don't think a screwdriver will hold in the sand. Cool trick though. John F, I read your instructions a couple of times, and I have to admit I am not following them. When you say roll the kite I assume you me flip it 180 degrees from nose towards you to tail towards you. And maybe another flip in the same direction making it 360 degrees. But I don't see how this would work. Must be my lack of experience. Last night I got the kite, Prism Quantum, and put it together. It is bigger then I expected. No wonder it has strong pull. So looking at it, if I lay it down on its back with the nose facing away from me, then the gap created by the trailing edge standoffs could catch wind and flip over? Or it would take a strong wind to catch those areas? Also when I pull is it likely to dig into the sand? I guess this weekend I can find out for myself, but it is always good to learn from those that have gone before you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandpa Posted October 10, 2007 Report Share Posted October 10, 2007 I will be at the beach, so I don't think a screwdriver will hold in the sand. Cool trick though. Just get a longer screwdriver Drinking a screwdriver can't hurt I have a few stakes that I made from old gearshift handles from old cars I used to have and I carry a bag of tent pegs also. They're cheap and light. Make sure you push the stake in at an angle for more grip... the top of the stake should point in to the wind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Barresi Posted October 11, 2007 Report Share Posted October 11, 2007 Described another way, if I follow this discussion. 1. Lay the kite on it's back, tail towards you. 2. Lift the tail, so the nose is pointed down. 3. Lay the tail backwards so the nose is pointed towards you. When done correctly, it's like the kite fell onto it's face in light wind... Except that the lines are draped over the back of the kite, towards the flier. Once you're back at the handles, steadily (and evenly) draw both lines back until the kite flips over. This is the standard launch method I use when I do not have a ground stake. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobB Posted October 11, 2007 Report Share Posted October 11, 2007 Hey KT... I use a screwdriver that's about 15" long. It works in all ground types, even the hardest packed dirt field, soft sand, rocky sand, I've even jabbed it in between the cracks in the pavement of a parking lot. In sand, angle it back towards the wind to give it extra holding power. If you're worried about catching air under the kite at the beach, just put some sand on the kite to keep it in place while you set up. Once you pull back on the lines to stand the kite up, the sand dumps right off. The Quantum looks big when it's set up inside, but you'll be happy it's that big when you're flying it. It doesn't look so big when it's 75' away from you. Good luck ! ~Rob. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitetime Posted October 11, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2007 Ah, I got it now. I had to draw a leading edge on a post it and visilize the lines and reference a picture of the kite, but now it makes perfect sense. Really simple, but tricky. Cool trick that is. That sounds like it will be perfect. Thank you very much John F and John B, that trick just saved me a bunch of time and hassles. I will also take my longest screwdriver and see how that works. And yes, I am sure when it is 85 feet away it won't seem big at all. (Comes with 85 feet of 150 pound spectra line) I hope the winds are good on Saturday. I am excited now. I just need to wind up my iPod... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John F Posted October 11, 2007 Report Share Posted October 11, 2007 Described another way, if I follow this discussion.1. Lay the kite on it's back, tail towards you. 2. Lift the tail, so the nose is pointed down. 3. Lay the tail backwards so the nose is pointed towards you. When done correctly, it's like the kite fell onto it's face in light wind... Except that the lines are draped over the back of the kite, towards the flier. Once you're back at the handles, steadily (and evenly) draw both lines back until the kite flips over. This is the standard launch method I use when I do not have a ground stake. Good description John. You have a way with breaking things down. No wonder it is so easy for people to joing you on an IQuad line. I think I learned this setup and lauch technique from you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Barresi Posted October 12, 2007 Report Share Posted October 12, 2007 I think I remember that discussion. Not so long ago, you've learned a lot in a short time! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karMeister Posted December 8, 2007 Report Share Posted December 8, 2007 HI! im new! i just got my kite the other day and flew it today! Im getting the hang of this! =P thanks for all the info...I used a rock to hold the kite down on its back until i asked some locals (kids) to lend me a hand =P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hedgewarden Posted December 10, 2007 Report Share Posted December 10, 2007 After more than 10 hours flying time, I think I qualify as more than a Newbie. I even know which direction the kite might turn when I pull on the right line. Unless, of course, the right line is in my left hand - wow, there's a trip! Stakes (screwdrivers, golf-ball- or dice-on-a-stick, etc.) work well in sand if you lay the kite back enough that the wind pushes the kite down rather than up. Had one self-launch, which was one more than enough. One option for setting up is to set the kite and then the lines. You need to hold the kite down, or set it in an position that does not self launch. (John's method is interesting, I might try that.) However, I do the lines first. 1. Stake the handles/straps of the line. 2. Run the line out, down wind. Carry your kite with you. Hold the winder correctly in the top-center hold, and the figure-8 winding pattern will mostly unwind automatically. 3. Assemble the kite, nose up-wind. I attach the lines after the spreaders, but before the standoffs to avoid catching wind until I have the lines to help me control the kite. 4. Set the kite on its tips at about 45 degrees slope away from the wind, lines tight. It will not self-launch, in my experience, even in gusty winds and the stake in sand. 5. Walk back to the handles (stake). I stand on the handles/straps, remove the stake, place in pocket or side-strap on denim jacket, and then pick up the handles/straps. 6. A tug and we are OFF Walk of shame: 1. Stake the handles/straps of the line. This is natural, since that is the end of the line you are on at the time of oh-oh. 2. Walk down to the kite. 3. Set the kite on its tips at about 45 degrees slope away from the wind, lines tight. It will not self-launch, in my experience, even in gusty winds and the stack in sand. (If the kite is at the edge of the wind window, you may need to move it toward the center) 4. Walk back to the handles (stake). I stand on the handles/straps, remove the stake, place in pocket or strap on denim jacket, and then pick up the handles/straps. 5. A tug and we are OFF Notice the similarity in the routines. I am (significantly) over 50 years old, so the fewer routines I need to memorize, the better. As for directly launching from these unplanned landings , I am only just starting to learn those tricks. My goal, learn to axel. OK - rank newbie. But having a lot of fun! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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