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DeafThunder

Rods: The difference ?

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Goes without saying, it isn't a good idea to mix late model GT rods with the other stiffer rods, otherwise one wing can / will distort more than the other.

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Being guilty of making Frankenstein-frames I think I might go a check my current rods.

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Sometimes mixing rods can sub for something in a persons left/right reflexes/strengths. What are GT rods?

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Sometimes mixing rods can sub for something in a persons left/right reflexes/strengths. What are GT rods?

Some rod sets have been produced recently that have a Green Tinge in the labels. They have a different flex to an earlier produced rod of the same type.

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Ok! GT = Green Tinge,  Now I need to look up Green Tinge, what's green tinge?

A slight green colour where it shouldn't be. At the start of the thread, the rod had some green colouring at the edge of the label. Slightly green colouring.

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Not just a green tinge, but little green wraps at both ends of the silver label. Sort of an olive green on my diamonds, not sure if that has been carried to all labeling yet. But that's how it is on my diamond rods.

Other than my diamond rods, everything else is "vintage".

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I'll be darn, I never saw the word "tinge" before, it looks like it should sound like "teen-gue"

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On May 14, 2016 at 6:38 PM, hyzakite said:

Sometimes mixing rods can sub for something in a persons left/right reflexes/strengths. What are GT rods?

GT = green trim

Mixing rods to compensate for physical imbalance sounds to me a lot like putting one smaller wheel on a car because I slump to the right.

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On May 14, 2016 at 9:35 PM, SparkieRob said:

Being guilty of making Frankenstein-frames I think I might go a check my current rods.

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The problem is that it seems that I can't mix newer rods (green label) with older rods (no label or silver label).  Unfortunately, I've broken a rod or two from an older frame -- and can't use the rods from the newer frame to replace.  And now that a couple of the green label rods have snapped (which has never happened before), I have two partial frames.  

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1 hour ago, John Barresi said:

GT = green trim

Mixing rods to compensate for physical imbalance sounds to me a lot like putting one smaller wheel on a car because I slump to the right.

Sounds a lot like Sprint Cup/Nascar/Winston Cup racing, an air pressure adjustment here, a trackbar adjustment there, finally after 500 miles you might have it right, but then again maybe not. And something keeps you tweeking on. But you can't always get what you want!

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???? You would be the first person to say that they don't fit each other! If replacing in a frame, I would go with pairs, ie - both verts or both wingtips! 

You should be able to use them - just be aware of them!

"The problem is that it seems that I can't mix newer rods (green label) with older rods (no label or silver label).  Unfortunately, I've broken a rod or two from an older frame -- and can't use the rods from the newer frame to replace.  And now that a couple of the green label rods have snapped (which has never happened before), I have two partial frames." 

As far as I know - you can interchange any of the 1.5 frame parts in any other 1.5 frame!!

 

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Almost losing the original question, I think mixing rods is no big deal, you end up with a collection of mis matched rods no matter what you do, deal with it!

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Here is what I'm looking at closely,

1 The seam of the green/Kevlar wrap does not match up with the seam of the silver label. Therefore the Kevlar center wrap which actually overlaps itself by approx. 1/4" is not part of the label.

2 You can clearly see the slight overlap of the silver label seam which is approx. 1/16" therefore the label is not part of the green/Kevlar wrap.

3 I can clearly see, looking at the rod from the side, an indent/rise where the Kevlar wrap meets the carbon wrap, I can actually see the thickness of the silver label against the green wrap.

4 When I place this GT rod into the ferrule of an older silver labeled 3wrap rod I can clearly see the thickness of the older rod is more than the GT rod, and placed in the ferrule of a black older race rod the thickness of the GT rod is more than the older race rod.

I haven't used these new GT rods yet, but I can predict where it will break if it does by seeing that indent it the Kevlar and carbon wrap, is it because they react to curing differently that causes that indent? Who knows? By putting the Kevlar wrap in the center of what actually could be a 2wrap rod is it a 3wrap equivalent? Who knows? Is it a cost cutting measure that failed? Who knows?

What kite and wind condition did the rod break in? If I'm switching to an extra-vent with 4wrap rods at winds around 17mph and stop flying at gusts around 20mph, will I ever see a GT rod break? Who knows? I have some race spl rods with different wraps I wonder where they are going to break?

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I think the tendency, in regard to kiting in general, is to make the framing tubes/rods lighter and stronger. As materials, processes and technology improve, so should the overall quality of the finished product. However, as with all human attempts at improvement, there is a learning curve that will undoubtedly involve some failures. That is how we learn.

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47 minutes ago, hyzakite said:

What kite and wind condition did the rod break in? If I'm switching to an extra-vent with 4wrap rods at winds around 17mph and stop flying at gusts around 20mph, will I ever see a GT rod break? Who knows? I have some race spl rods with different wraps I wonder where they are going to break?

I think I broke them both on a full sail 1.5 in about 10-15 mph winds.  (I was using at least one GT 3-wrap rod).  I was extra surprised that, both times, it was a vertical shaft that broke.   I haven't been flying that long -- but I've definitely flown the older 3-wrap rods in much stronger winds without damage.

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Vertical rods actually take the most punishment, as they are only supported at the ends! The way a Rev bridle works, the LE is supported better, even though longer and in pieces. 

hyzakite - I am not sure the green is Kevlar. If(??), Rev is cost cutting, why use an expensive material? The extra wrap/label/whatever theory on changing the strength of a tube, seems reasonable. 

Again, I'm not sure what is up with the rod difference - just know that there is one. Causes for sure - UNKNOWN!

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This rod was in a friends kite when we caught a gust. I have old RRs, he had new RRs. His broke and mine did not..doubt it means a thing ...but happened.

13412862_945239162288989_8292964912385735122_n.jpg

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1 hour ago, tkrinor said:

This rod was in a friends kite when we caught a gust. I have old RRs, he had new RRs. His broke and mine did not..doubt it means a thing ...but happened.

13412862_945239162288989_8292964912385735122_n.jpg

Thanks for the pic, I was thinking the break was right at the outer green to black spots. But! A double break on the same tube at the same time? Is this a staged picture? Cut it out!

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You have to use the right rods for the situation at hand. For instance; for serious flying, Rod Serling -- for ballet, Rod Stewart -- for just goofing around, Roddy McDowell, and so on . . . . 

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13 hours ago, hyzakite said:

Thanks for the pic, I was thinking the break was right at the outer green to black spots. But! A double break on the same tube at the same time? Is this a staged picture? Cut it out!

The breaks are real, gathered the pieces for photo. It was a vertical.

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I'm starting to think, the next kite I sell I'll make sure I send those rods with the kite instead of even trying to fly them at all.

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I spoke to Lolly about a month ago and I asked her about the green label rods.  She told me that all rods made starting in 2016 have the new labels.  She said nothing is different except for the label.  I do know when Diamonds came out,  and they were supposed to be lighter than Race,  yet my Diamond frame weighed almost 3 grams heavier than my Race frame. I have weighed different frames,  same wrap,  and get different weights.  There doesn't seem to be much QC in the rod dept at Rev. Don't get me wrong,  I ABSOLUTELY LOVE all my Revs,  just wish there was consistency in the rods. 

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No QC is the problem! No way the same type rods should have so much variance in them. And there is a difference in the GL rods, they won't admit it. Something changed - the material, the lay up procedure, curing, etc - who knows. On their FB page in some comments, Lolly tried to pass it off as we didn't realize the rods have a "spine" to orient! I have never worried about how my rods go into the kite - EVER! Bought my first Rev back in the late 90s and never took time to "orient" my spars. Something is different and I haven't heard what! 

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I've never heard of a " spine " either. Seems to me if the rods were meant to go in a certain orientation or direction,  they'd be labeled as such. 

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