Edmond Dragut

first quad build

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Supersonic template 3 inch bigger at the V cut. i used the original frame and spars. is flying good but i need to do some adjustments at the bridle to make him to respond better at hovering and slow fly

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thank you,i try to keep a simply design to avoid mistakes on stitching,i find out to work better with 2 rows of stitches on to an 1935 Singer then a zig-zag from a modern one

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6 minutes ago, Edmond Dragut said:

thank you,i try to keep a simply design to avoid mistakes on stitching,i find out to work better with 2 rows of stitches on to an 1935 Singer then a zig-zag from a modern one

I've heard more than once the older machines can lay a better stitch than newer ones.  I think either stitch approach should be fine. I used a little of both on my recent build too..

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I like it. Will have to try it next time I see you. I can help with the bridle because I have made many from scratch. If the line attachment points on the bridle are too close to the sail it will make it very twitchy in flight.

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one person's twitchy is another's responsive.

A flexible frame requires a longish bridle so pilot commands don't distort the frame,... for example I fly in indoor kite about 3 x 9 feet, the frame is mostly point 125 carbon tubes.  They bend just from gravity, imagine a hard command, you could probably break a stick if there's no bridle at all!

I stiffened hard frame could be flown without a bridle at all.  Jeffery Burka flies a rev2 like this & UPWIND too.

if you want some smoothness built-into the bridle, examine how the bridle on a 1.5 can be wiggled at the center attachment point and also how the hinges connect on the separate pieces.  All those wiggle points are why folks do the Whump,.. they are pre-loading the bridle for more instant response on command.  You can put the smoothness in or you can take it out thru bridle fabrication and experiments.  

These tests are a lot easier with a partner helping out.  Someone to stand directly underneath the kite and see how the bridle legs are tightened or loosened by flight.  What happens if you move the positioning or change the overall length of the bridle legs slightly?

Test one variable at a time, so you can control an expected outcome, take copious notes and work on the "feel" of your endeavors

-plm

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i have a spool of 150# so will not be a problem to make some bridle and test them, i have full thrust on your skills and judgement Mark so i am on.

Till then i will also try JB method for indoor ,no bridle at all. i will keep tided just the spars points and see what is happening

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Be careful using no bridle, like the indoor, on outdoor kites! The bridle is there to equalize the stresses on the frame. Attaching at only the top and bottom of the vertical, ends up putting all your stress on them and focuses more at the intersection of the vert and LE. Reason for no bridle on the indoor is you never have the same amounts of overall stress, as you do outdoors. I use an Indoor outside some, but can really feel a difference between it and my usual outdoor stuff. 

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I thought at the stress on spars and you are right Wayne. now seeing black on white seams to be a bad idea especially do the big surface of the kite.

 

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And I think you might need some stronger verts in that design. Funny - but the verts have the most stress put on them! A lot of times I put 3 or 4 wrap verts in, while using a race LE! Nothing says I can't mix them!! As it is, my Zen has 3 different types in it!! But looking at how big the sail area, and shallow the "V" area, I would suspect more stress at the verts. IMHO

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8 minutes ago, Edmond Dragut said:

the frame is a SLE 4 wraps LE and 4 wraps spars. 

That's good. I'll talk to you about using "stays" to keep the belly from rolling under when I see you.

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micro-carbon "fingers" like a bat's wing,

you could try a "leach line" in the trailing edge to force an alteration into the airstream, it won't flatten out fully no matter what you do!

even vents with velcro covers over them too, so you could open or close off more air passage thru the sail

you might run the leach line thru or next to the leading edge tube, so you can pre-stress or pre-curve it somewhat.  That cups air pressure but diminishes tracking (life is full of choices)

no way you'll break that frame w/o impacts involved

enjoy the experience of testing and tuning

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