OK,, I was a bit harsh

[JoneZ]

I admit, I was a bit harsh on the quantum in my post of my experiences from beg. to adv. (here -> http://kitelife.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=3157 ).

I picked up a Quantum (Ice pattern) at GI Joes (YES GI joes ::: it will never be just "joes"). Going out of business sale,, I ended up finding out that they were cheap cheap, so I trolled around the GI Joes til I found one (pic below). $60 -- YOINK!!

I just got done with its maiden voyage and I must say that I was a bit harsh in my initial opinion of the quantums capabilities. Mind you, I made some adjustments:

- took off the "EZ Line connectors"

- replaced the L.E. tensioners with solid 150# bridle line

- tightened up the "shock absorber" on the tail end of the kite to take away the elasticity factor

I actually tricked her quite easily to be honest. I think at the time, I was obviously a beginner, and somewhat frustrated that I wasn't quite "getting it". Frustration leading to instant gratification syndrome I think.

I still stand by my word that the quantum is a yanker kite -- meaning more harsh inputs are required to get some tricks off -- as well as it being a tad touchy in stalled positions -- mostly flares and fades -- due to the wingspan difference (7ft as opposed to 8).

The wingtip snags, upper L.E. fitting snags, and "breakdown" ferrule (midway down the leading edge) snags are still a b*tch, and will require some custom modifying, but I think this kite has the potential (when modified) to be a pretty decent kite.

Still, if you are starting out kiting, I would still recommend getting a beginner 5ft wingspan kite,, learning the basics of flight, then grabbing a full size (8ft) kite to learn the more advanced maneuvers and tricks. It'll save you a lot of headaches.

Im going to keep this thread running with my mod's to the quantum that I will be doing over the next month or so, hopefully to create a log of how to improve this kites flight characteristics for other quantum owners.

Mods on the list so far:

-- Fastening ripstop nylon over the "breakdown ferrule" midway down the leading edge (because Im NEVER going to break down the L.E.)

-- Fastening ripstop nylon over the backside of the upper and lower leading edge fittings (to prevent line snags)

-- Installing end caps on the Nock end wingtips (if thats even what they're called. lol)

-- Removing the current spine tensioner (which has an elestic shock absorber -- bad for sail distortion) and installing a rigid velcro spine tensioner.

--Installing a Leech Line (after the spine tensioner is replaced).

oh woah is the life of a kite tweaker (modifyer, not meth addict. o.0 lol).

-cheers KiteLife

~Jon

[JoneZ]

Did I say over the next month? lol. More like next week.

These are the modifications I have made so far (pictures below sequentially)

--fastened the ripstop onto the upper/lower L.E. fittings to prevent snags (2 pics)

--removed prism label on base of spine, and sewed it to my new spine tensioner (2 pics)

--removed shock absorber on the tail, and installed my new rigid spine tensioner (2 pics)

--installed my leech line (1 pic)

--fully assembled, yet to be tested. (1 pic)

--my future wife snapping a pic of me sewing.

Winds are light today, so I can't go test it out, but needless to say, I can't wait.

I'll let you all know how these mods worked.

PS. for the mean time, I threw some duct tape over the breakdown ferrules on the leading edge. we'll see how that works for now.

-cheers

~Jon

[JoneZ]

grabbed some 5-10Mph wind this afternoon before the rains, and she flew great. Leech line stopped the noise, and increased the sails ability to hold wind. The new tail held out great, and no more L.E. fitting snags.

[Dean750]

I'm glad all worked out so far. But as someone once told me.... Fly clean.

Snags for the most part means you didn't really commit to what you were trying in the first place. Not enough slack.

Flying your Widow will teach you how to do the tricks you want to learn. Moving up to a Pro level kite will allow you to do the tricks, but you damned well better commit. You'll either look good, or you'll look like a novice.

I remember I bought the Benson Box of Tricks because it could do anything being done with just a flic and it would self recover. Great on learning how to do the trick. But take that back to the MEFM or the Illusion and a sloppy trick looked, well sloppy.

I thought the Box of Tricks could be better than what it was compared to the MEFM. I rebridled it, took the bow line off, made a lighter bow line..... it just didn't do what I wanted. A kite is made to fly the way you get it with some minor adjustments.

You saw this with the Widow in light wind.

I just think that if you want a kite to learn the basics on the Quantum is a good kite to start with. Learn to fly that Widow in lighter wind (not necessarily trickin') and you'll be ready for that Pro kite your going to buy at some point.

Just a thought.

Dean

On a side note though, good looking mods. Glad to hear it worked.

[JoneZ]

Totally understand where you're coming from bro. Im learning everything (precision and freestyling) on the Widow. The Quantum is just another kite to my collection -- and something I can work on. hehe.

As for tweaking, yes, definitely agreed that kites are made to work within their limits with only minor adjustments to flight and physics based characteristics (bridle mods, frame mods), with the exception to physical characteristics.

Now from my experience, the quantum straight out of the factory is a frustrating kite to learn the basics on, flat out. The beginner is going to snag his/her lines every 3 minutes, and with the quantum (or any of prisms lower end factory kites for that matter) its more like every 30 seconds with the addition of that breakdown ferrule, and the LE fittings not being covered. Ask shanobi187 (my neighbour). lol Bought him a Nexus for his B-day, and just watching him in his constant battles with walks of shame make me hurt. lol. Keep in mind, that this is regarding slack line tricks. And lets face it,, even beginners aren't just going to stick to flying patterns and angles -- they're going to push the envelope and learn their axles and flic flacs and lazy susans, etc, on whatever first kite they have.

Im not saying to beginners to go out and mod their kites (but it sure does seem like it huh? lol ), but to just be aware of what they are buying, in relation to what they are going to use it for (freestyling vs precision).

Thanks for the props on the Mods m8 . They turned out really well actually. Im impressed on how much my sewing skills have improved. Broke the needle on the sewing machine punching through the tail -- luckily I had a few replacements.

How's the repairs on that MEFM going? I can't wait to see it up in the air. And you better be PMing me on when ur going out for the maiden voyage. I wanna be there!

-cheers bro

~Jon

[Dean750]

I'm out here in Albany at least every other day for at least 4 hours. I fixed the MEFM as SOON as I got home the Sunday we finally met. Between your Widow and Johns Shiva I developed the itch again. If you can make it down on a weekend, this month than just let me know. Between the two of us, something is going to fly. If not this month, then starting next month I'm hoping for maybe a trip every two weeks minimum to Delta Park. I'll be at the Clinic the 21st through the 25th too I guess.

You'll get your shot with the MEFM. I want another go with that Widow in some wind.

Hope to fly soon,

Dean

[JoneZ]

Went out in between the rains today with the Quantum (since my widow is one standoff shy of a kite) again. This time it was about 10-13Mph winds steady.

I remember flying the booger (my old green quantum), and even the fact that I was new to flying at the time, it didn't fly even close to the way this one does now, or how it flew before the Mods. That leech line really spiced up that kite. Believe it or not, it has more crisp precision turns than the Widow does (although I haven't adapted a turbo bridle to the widow as on the Quantum).

Fades are so much easier to hold. Flares, not so much, but that could be me just getting use to the kite -- seem to be a little "left-to-right'ish".

Pulled off a solid YoYo with no stoppers, so that was fun, and relatively easy to pull off, although I didnt dare hold it for more than 1 second before unwrapping.

Now that I have the breakdown ferrule covered completely (took off the duct tape and fastened some ripstop over the ferrule), as well as the back sides of the LE fittings the lines just roll off the back of the kite if theres not enough slack on a trick -- making recoveries a snap (or a couple snaps, if they get caught on the wingtips [which are also wrapped])

Getting the Kite on its belly for a lazy susan is kind of a chore still, but once its in that stalled position, its very comfortable (was able to easily coast it down for a wingtip landing and launch). Still havent pulled off a lazy yet, as getting it on its back is a little difficult (mostly due to wind conditions atm).

All in all, I would seriously recommend installing a leech line if you own a quantum.

Im going to work on some step by step instructions for ppl interested that aren't quite sure of how to go about it (not liable for damages, mind you ).

One thing I need to come up with a solution to, is the damn lower spreaders. Since I removed the shock absorber on the tail section, every time I land hard, or try a tip stab (which usually ends up in a 'hard landing' since Im still learning that one), it pops the spreader out from the center "T" post, resulting in a very shameful walk.

I was thinking of possibly removing the "T" and gluing it to one of the lower spreaders (about 1/4" farther out than it would normally sit, to create a little more tension when the other spreader is attached to it), then feeding it through the center hole and attaching it to the other spreader. I'd have to stick a couple of 1/4" spacers into the "T" section, and also maybe reduce my standoff lengths by 2/16". thats a hardcore Mod, so Im trying to think of another way,, possibly replacing the center T with something completely different and more secure that will still allow the spreaders to sit in their normal positions.

Any sugg. on that one?

[The Kite Shoppe]

Went out in between the rains today with the Quantum (since my widow is one standoff shy of a kite) again. This time it was about 10-13Mph winds steady.

I remember flying the booger (my old green quantum), and even the fact that I was new to flying at the time, it didn't fly even close to the way this one does now, or how it flew before the Mods. That leech line really spiced up that kite. Believe it or not, it has more crisp precision turns than the Widow does (although I haven't adapted a turbo bridle to the widow as on the Quantum).

Fades are so much easier to hold. Flares, not so much, but that could be me just getting use to the kite -- seem to be a little "left-to-right'ish".

Pulled off a solid YoYo with no stoppers, so that was fun, and relatively easy to pull off, although I didnt dare hold it for more than 1 second before unwrapping.

Now that I have the breakdown ferrule covered completely (took off the duct tape and fastened some ripstop over the ferrule), as well as the back sides of the LE fittings the lines just roll off the back of the kite if theres not enough slack on a trick -- making recoveries a snap (or a couple snaps, if they get caught on the wingtips [which are also wrapped])

Getting the Kite on its belly for a lazy susan is kind of a chore still, but once its in that stalled position, its very comfortable (was able to easily coast it down for a wingtip landing and launch). Still havent pulled off a lazy yet, as getting it on its back is a little difficult (mostly due to wind conditions atm).

All in all, I would seriously recommend installing a leech line if you own a quantum.

Im going to work on some step by step instructions for ppl interested that aren't quite sure of how to go about it (not liable for damages, mind you ).

One thing I need to come up with a solution to, is the damn lower spreaders. Since I removed the shock absorber on the tail section, every time I land hard, or try a tip stab (which usually ends up in a 'hard landing' since Im still learning that one), it pops the spreader out from the center "T" post, resulting in a very shameful walk.

I was thinking of possibly removing the "T" and gluing it to one of the lower spreaders (about 1/4" farther out than it would normally sit, to create a little more tension when the other spreader is attached to it), then feeding it through the center hole and attaching it to the other spreader. I'd have to stick a couple of 1/4" spacers into the "T" section, and also maybe reduce my standoff lengths by 2/16". thats a hardcore Mod, so Im trying to think of another way,, possibly replacing the center T with something completely different and more secure that will still allow the spreaders to sit in their normal positions.

Any sugg. on that one?

Get two heavy duty rubber bands and larks head them to the end of the lower spreaders, then loop the other end of the rubber band over the center T.

Keeps them snug in the T

Got your PM..... Saturday looks like the next best day with no rain in the forecast

[tonycarl60]

I've seen some kites that have a short piece of bungi cord going from the base of one spreader at the T to the base of the other spreader.

[JoneZ]

Get two heavy duty rubber bands and larks head them to the end of the lower spreaders, then loop the other end of the rubber band over the center T.

Keeps them snug in the T

Got your PM..... Saturday looks like the next best day with no rain in the forecast

Right on, I'll try that. Should have some broccoli stocks in the fridge with some rubber bands on them. hehe.

If Im still not working on Friday (rain + economy = no work this week in my field. ), that may be the day I come and see ya for some supplies, cuz we're thinkin of Cannon beach again this weekend. Got to meet with our caterer, as well as finalize our reception hall. That is, if MaryBeth is over her cold by then. o.0

I'll need a new standoff for the widow, some 7/16" nock end caps, and 2 APA fittings for yoyo stoppers (gonna install em on my Quantum). Oh!! Do you carry self-adhesive ripstop nylon as well? I've seen it in shops at the coast. Neat idea. I was thinkin of carrying a yard or so in my kite bag for when I get rips or punctures (got one now I need to fix on the Widow).

I'll call ya on Fri T.

Thanks for the advice.!!

~Jon

[JoneZ]

Get two heavy duty rubber bands and larks head them to the end of the lower spreaders, then loop the other end of the rubber band over the center T.

Keeps them snug in the T

Got your PM..... Saturday looks like the next best day with no rain in the forecast

Right on, I'll try that. Should have some broccoli stocks in the fridge with some rubber bands on them. hehe.

Gave that a shot, and for all intents and purposes it works, but man, is it a b*tch to set up. I have to think of another way here. Theres gotta be something.

Got some brainstorming to do.

~Jon

[JoneZ]

I've seen some kites that have a short piece of bungi cord going from the base of one spreader at the T to the base of the other spreader.

Good idea. Thing is, that my spreaders arent hollow. they're solid core carbon. the real $$ stuff. lol

[JoneZ]

Some photos uploaded. The cross section of the T is metal. It is hollow straight through, with 2 stoppers dead center so the spreaders won't float freely inside the T.

If that T section was rubber, and slightly smaller (by say, 1/16"), with a small insert set dead center in it, I think that would work. Thats the only thing I could come up with -- an idea in which the parts Im thinking of could quite possibly not exist. lol

The actual spreader diameter is 3/16"

The spreader sits inside the T section 1 1/4"

the T section's diameter is 1/4"

The length of the "T" is 2 5/8"

Ho-Hum...

~Jon