Trimming for indoor flight

[godric]

My intention in starting this thread is twofold: first, to get some specific help on one of my kites, but generally to provide opportunity for Q&A for anybody flying anything indoors.

So there I am, in a relatively small indoor space (35' x 55'), trying to fly my Prism 3-D, which after all holds at least one endurance record for this kind of thing, and it's tail-heavy. Just keeps falling out of the air. I trim the bridle to bring the nose forward a bit, to see if some momentum will help it, but as soon as I slow down it wants to stall and slide backwards to the ground. I actually added some weight to the nose and it improved things a bit, while of course reducing the overall flyability of the kite, so I gave that up.

In both the tipped-back and tipped-forward modes I was able to do up-and-overs, and the kite would flatten out nicely for just a second, but as I started to turn it back into a circular path it would drop out of the air again. Since (a) I know others have succeeded at this endeavor, several of them ( with this kite, I could use some advice on how to proceed from here. This is a stock 3-D, about a year old, with the standoffs set for maximum lift, flying on about 10' lines. I'm thinking maybe helium-filled leading edges ...

[mirecat]

The 3-D likes to keep moving. Some indoor kites are like that. It is a kite that will help you to become a more efficient indoor flyer. It's the trickability vs. float like a feather thing.

[godric]

Thanks, Scott. Am I correct in understanding you to say that the 3-D is more trickable, but requires a lot more movement and attention as a result? Is that related strictly to wing loading, or are there other factors that obtain?

Could I also trouble you to help me understand "efficiency" as it applies to indoor flying?

[mirecat]

"Am I correct in understanding you to say that the 3-D is more trickable, but requires a lot more movement and attention as a result?

Could I also trouble you to help me understand "efficiency" as it applies to indoor flying?"

Yes, but not necessarily a lot more movement. Part of the extra work is keeping the kite in motion. Finding that point where you give it just enough energy, and not waste any extra energy, is the efficiency I was talking about.

A Wren is an easier kite to fly indoors because it's more forgiving. It's also nice and slow, graceful , and floaty. It actually takes less energy to keep it in the air. It's harder to do a fast axle or 540 on a Wren rather than the slow tricks that it likes. It's so light and flimsy that you'll likely just jerk it out of the air, instead of getting that real fast trick. With the smaller stiffer indoor kites like the 3-D you'll get the quick tricks but it's harder to get the slow stuff. I really enjoy getting a slow low 540 with my indoor Pizazz that would rather be moving quicker, like the 3-D. Of course, I love the incredibly fast tricks with it, too. There really are so many different indoor flying styles. Each kite has it's strengths, or things that it likes to do. Each flyer develops a style or styles,(If you are really good). I think it's important to find that connection, but it can only be done by spending the time flying.

Hope this helps, but if not, I don't mind rambling on.

[ant man]

ive flown my 3d indoors and it is a hard kite to keep up but does do tricks well im still learning indoor flying and im so fsr doing well with my 3d

[kite slinger]

Lift and drive

slow floaty easy up and overs and 360 ,pinwheels, side-slides are lift kites some might be able to fade but needs to rock out of it

fades .axles rollups ,back spins are kites with drive for pitch base tricks

[ant man]

well id have to learn those tricks outdoors first for right now im happy just keeping up in the air ive been doing loops and 360s and some type of spin trick where the kite looks like a star when doing the trick i just jerk lon lines and the thing does it i dont know how really