tip pivots/ladder up down--and a little zone envy

[tkrinor]

Not sure of the terminology, I think it is ladder up/down or tip pivots, like pivoting up a rope. Mine are sloppy…not tight at all. I worked on them last week end, but the wind was as gusty as I had ever seen, tough flying.

Any tips I can take for next weekend’s work to get them tighter. Attempting the move backwards didn’t even compute and I gave up quickly.

Couldn’t get into a zone last weekend. Rain and gusty wind.

[SparkieRob]

I believe Polo (Polokites) has some great YouTube "how to" for this.

[mystainedskin]

When having issues like this ..and the wind permits. Try sitting down and taking it real slow. Don't worry about how clean it is, that will come with time once you have got the basic movement down. This what I do, seems to help limit and isolate movements.

[Paul LaMasters]

add more DOWN in the leader tuning, so you don't fight the gusty conditions that cause surging suddenly

restrict that forward flight movement, square the sail to the wind or even angle it away from the leading edge (adding too much down)

Longer line lengths will slow the kite down, or heavier weight linesets

rotate your hips and shoulders as you step backwards for each movement,

stop on the quarter turns (it's a two handed movement to control WHERE it stops, oversteer) INCH your way thru the movements and stop long enough that folks know you meant to do that

As you become more proficient you'll be able to just wiggle your thumbs/squeeze your grip slightly instead of all this physical movement outlined above (unless it's dead calm wind)

practice can't be purchased, keep at it, it will get clean and snappy with enough time, effortless eventually.

[Wayne Dowler]

I'm with you tkrinor- I can go up alright, down is a sometimes thing! But it's all just flying as much as you can and working on it some, every time out!! Keep at it!!!!

[SkyPuppets LimitVoodoo]

I have trouble with ladder down as well. I have come to find that it is important to have a more balanced tuning setup, with regards to leaders... I can ladder up regardless of my tuning, but to ladder down cleanly requires more forward in my setup than I typically use. So if you typically fly with lots of brake already, I'd suggest adding some forward tuning into your setup to help with ladder down.

[mystainedskin]

I usually walk and pump...a lot of brake. Backwards going up with my best pop and lock moves...and then forwards coming down. Regardless of wind if trying to be precise. It gives you that extra little bit of control...

Or is that classified in the "whump" category?

[Paul LaMasters]

I have trouble with ladder down as well. I have come to find that it is important to have a more balanced tuning setup, with regards to leaders... I can ladder up regardless of my tuning, but to ladder down cleanly requires more forward in my setup than I typically use. So if you typically fly with lots of brake already, I'd suggest adding some forward tuning into your setup to help with ladder down.

alternatively, you could also change your grip position (higher or lower)

or

you can reach over the handle's top with your index finger (for even more brief burst of "forward drive" you could use that lane-changing high traffic middle finger!) and grab the top line. This effective changes your wrist rotation angle (moving grips) or shortens the top line (reaching over)

Here's an example. I too fly with a lot of down tuning, so if I have to hold an upright hover at the top of the window (forming a ball) I'll pinch the top lines briefly. By like token if I'm flying the reverse octagon, I might slip my pinky finger to the bottom of the foam to take away any forward.

Folks, try changing your grip position or pinching to easily change from one priority tuning preference towards another!

[SkyPuppets LimitVoodoo]

alternatively, you could also change your grip position (higher or lower)

or

you can reach over the handle's top with your index finger (for even more brief burst of "forward drive" you could use that lane-changing high traffic middle finger!) and grab the top line.  This effective changes your wrist rotation angle (moving grips) or shortens the top line (reaching over)

 

This is excellent advice my friend. Alternatively, you could lift the top leaders with your index fingers, rather than pinch with them

[tkrinor]

I usually walk and pump...a lot of brake. Backwards going up with my best pop and lock moves...and then forwards coming down. Regardless of wind if trying to be precise. It gives you that extra little bit of control...

Or is that classified in the "whump" category?

Thanks folks, there were 2 tips I tried that helped quite a bit. First taking a step back for up and forward for down, and flying with both hands.

It was a bit gusty, for instance NOAA said 10G31 at 12:58 today.(and it was raining at times so it was heavy sail), but definitely saw an improvement.

[John Barresi]

Glad to hear the great tips in this topic have helped.

You might also experiment with making sure you have clear forward flight (r/l, l/r) when you initiate the move...

Imagine kicking the kite into forward for about 2"-3" (yes - inches), then using that moderated drive to carve the turn, powering up/down and rotating your body/stance as needed.

For reverse pivots, I use a little less r/l l/r initiative and tend to bring my hands down into my lower abdomen, rather than toward my chest (as with forward moves).

[Codywater]

My tip pivots and ladder moves were also a bit sloppy, then John told me to imagine flying straight forward before starting the turn up/down. Doing this made them a lot more crisp, and as you get the feel for it you can make the forward flight smaller and smaller until it's not perceptible by anyone watching, only by you flying the maneuver.

[tkrinor]

Thanks gang, the tips really helped today, Not exactly carving up the sky, but somewhat recognizable. The little wump, and forward first flight made all the difference..appreciate the tips!

[mystainedskin]

I need to work on that forward flight move myself