Fixed my reflex today

[DTill]

One pesky sticker, a weird wrap and spring gone. Found some extra spars in my bag that are now useable. Anyone else try this? Let the comments fly. This forum is quiet and I'm in a conference tomorrow. 

[JWharton]

I know nothing of springs.

[Edmond Dragut]

i used two layers of electrical shrink tube to fix back the spring on the spar.  two years later is still holding 

[Wayne Dowler]

Perfectly fine to fly with no springs, if you want it that way. You could use shrink wrap and heat it with a soldering iron to hold those springs, if you like that. 

[DTill]

I guess the sarcasm wasn't obvious enough. I don't like flying with springs, I removed them so they fit in the bag easier.

[Wayne Dowler]

How's the sail work without them?? I would guess just like any other Rev sail. Is yours the XX or the smaller 1.5 size?

[DTill]

Flys normal, I bought a classic as my first Rev. I didn't know anything about Revs or Jon's history with them. Although I had met him and already owned a kymerra. I also picked up a reflex spider "thanks riff". But I rarely have a need for that much venting. Probably going to sell it and pick up a mid vent.

[makatakam]

23 hours ago, DTill said:

But I rarely have a need for that much venting.

You might check the wind speed to see how many days, in your area, the wind was over 18mph last couple of years before you sell the Spider. You may be surprised at how many days per year the wind is that strong. It's about 50 days per year in my neck of the woods. That means that almost 1 out 6 times I want to fly the Spider would be my choice. As Murphy's law states, the time you really need it you won't have one. I live in the Chicago area, "Windy City" and all, but the reference actually regards the politics and not the weather. Chicago is about average as far as wind speed goes, and before I had a full vent I spent many days flying very uncomfortably or not at all. 

If you can afford to keep it you might consider doing so. I recommend you have either a full- or extra-vent in your quiver.

[DTill]

I have a over built 100% mesh for the gnarly days. Looking

to fill a gap in the bag.

[makatakam]

Then you've got it covered. That's good. I just wanted to make sure you don't miss any smiles. 🙂

[Paul LaMasters]

On an SUL you'd want that killer glide, it is available w/o reflex springs, you want to assemble (end-caps, washers, holes thru LE, etc) such that you introduce a pronounced curvature,... over the top of the leading edge. Your palm should fit between the sail and leading edge, touching neither.  The bridle choice doesn't matter, we each have our preferences, only that all this crap is locked down, rigid, tight. 

 

You are after a glide where where you can toss the kite parallel with the ground, and it goes like frisbee,.... no handles or flying line, it flies an unbelievable distance straight away from you.  Test1

i prefer a bridle configuration where you are gripping outside of the frame,.... any wiggling in your choice of bridle smooths out flight by deminishing pilot commands, first take out the wiggle slop!

how much mass is necessary for enjoyable flight dynamics?  Not enough and the kite needs tending on all four lines (like a Decca), too much and you have to flail and run around to MAKE flight.

straight or bent leading edge construction?  My no-sew experience had 'em straight, but we used SLE 7/16 inch tubes in ours, so they "threw" like a javelin!  Years later 18 and I've learned a lot since those experiments

folded over leading edge sleeve, or thicker choice to add some mass?

All spectra bridle, figure of eight knots and nail polish painted, to dry over night!

3M'sVHB 9460 bonding tape and a craft iron

we want pictures and enjoy the journey, I've been on it since 1993

[DTill]

Just ditch the reflex spings, that's what I've done. They aren't needed and seem to be causing breaks. I used to think I was hard on a kite when I was learning, but now that I'm fairly good, I'm even harder on them. Most of my flying is traveling bicycle purposely tap a Le cap, bicycle tap Le cap, bicycle tap both lower vertical caps, fly to the top pull for a catch, throw and repeat. I've never broken a stick.  Granted if I'm flogging a kite that hard it has a 3 wrap in it, but I've also beat aP90 frame way beyond what it should've taken. Maybe I'm lucky or I have decent skills but I'm starting to wear out the caps on my full sail and starting to fly my mid vent most of the time. Inland winds whomp up the mid and make it fly. I think Rev is having issues with their rods lately, but my mid is classic w/ the reflex labeled rods. Are you flying an RX?

[riffclown]

Removing the springs Seems to be a common solution.  Do you think the breaking rods might be a recurrence of the green trimmed issue from a few years back?

[DTill]

I've never had an issue with the green trims, but  I have 2 sets. I'll put some 2wrap green rods in the mid and see if i break one.

[Buellbloke]

Reposted as the first post was in error. My apologies to any who responded. Findings have since changed some. Intial post was a rash response to a personal crisis lol This post sums up my feelings about my kite more precisely. Am not ready to ditch Reflex just yet.

Vertical, second flight quite strong winds at the upper end, brand new Reflex RX. I always ensure everything is seated properly. Launched, hovered vertical blew off WTF 😲☹️ top inner edge gave out 😮10mm ish of splits about as much as is fitted inside of the plug. Baffled, unhappy, hope this is not going to happen all the time otherwise be goodbye Revolution Reflex RX. My second Kite, first was the Pulse UK made, Skyshark P90 tubes, so not an utter newbie error....or was it. I've re-enforced all my tube ends with fibreglass parcel tape as used in the construction of Peter Powell Stunter Kites hoping this will help support an inherant weakness?? Joe reckons can carefully cut off the damage and re- use as a leading edge spar. Leading edge will shrink by 10mm but is already too long by 20mm ish, all that extra carbon sticking out is unsightly anyway lol. If it happens again the same will have a tidy leading edge, equal and a restored spare tube 😎 Am not keen on these plugs as they tend to fit uneven, the top one looks angled probably due to Reflex pressure and the bottoms wobble about some which can't be a good thing. Leading edge plugs fit just as uncertain. Caps from my Pulse seemed a much better idea. Top has a plastic sleeve around the plug, it offers no support I can see just gives a more tidy finish. All my plugs felt quite loose like the rods were only just under tension.

[riffclown]

This was a change made by Rev to go with ferrule based endcaps (slide inside the spar) as opposed to caps which enclosed and protected the spar. In the original style (caps) a spar with a small split could be glued and still used as long as it wasn't the ferruled junctions of the LE. The slightest crack in the new system becomes an instant stress point. This is one of the changes made by Revolution that had me seeking other options. The different size framing has some different characteristics but not all are advantages.

It's also worthy of note that in the reflex design it pays you to sleeve the friction point between the spar and the spring itself or the spring will eventually saw the spar in two at that point.

[Buellbloke]

3 hours ago, riffclown said:

This was a change made by Rev to go with ferrule based endcaps (slide inside the spar) as opposed to caps which enclosed and protected the spar. In the original style (caps) a spar with a small split could be glued and still used as long as it wasn't the ferruled junctions of the LE. The slightest crack in the new system becomes an instant stress point. This is one of the changes made by Revolution that had me seeking other options. The different size framing has some different characteristics but not all are advantages.

It's also worthy of note that in the reflex design it pays you to sleeve the friction point between the spar and the spring itself or the spring will eventually saw the spar in two at that point.

Got me on one now dude, so added a piece of fibreglass tape to both verticals in the place the spring moves as suggested, as well as both ends for support. Then found some 7.5mm carbon tube and added some tape to just over an inch sections. Once fitted was able to see exactly how much of the tube is loosley supported by the new style plugs. About 7mm and even that is a loose fit. I then left these sections on the plugs as they fit beautifully. Now my verticals are heavily supported at both ends with no wobbles from the loose fitting plugs. Bungees are still able to move the vertical so its not like am stressing anything, just supporting the load against the ends.

[midibot]

7 hours ago, riffclown said:

[...]

It's also worthy of note that in the reflex design it pays you to sleeve the friction point between the spar and the spring itself or the spring will eventually saw the spar in two at that point.

Neat.

So, heat shrink and trimmed vinyl end cap?

.

 

[riffclown]

22 minutes ago, midibot said:

Neat.

So, heat shrink and trimmed vinyl end cap?

.

 

Actually I didn't use Heat Shrink when I did mine originally.. I just heated the modified vinyl endcap enough to slip it over. it was plenty tight once cooled.

 

Whatever it takes to do the job without adding significant weight.

[Buellbloke]

29 minutes ago, midibot said:

Neat.

So, heat shrink and trimmed vinyl end cap?

.

 

I think earlier springs were fitted differently, heatshrink wouldnt look as tidy over these things.

[midibot]

5 minutes ago, riffclown said:

Actually I didn't use Heat Shrink when I did mine originally.. I just heated the modified vinyl endcap enough to slip it over. it was plenty tight once cooled.

 

Whatever it takes to do the job without adding significant weight.

Got it.

But the spring has been (re)attached - or reinforced - with heat shrink, yes?

And it looks like you have some on the spring itself.  Or some kind of tubing.  (The newish one I am examining as we speak is bare wire, held on with some kind of tape-like stuff labelled 'Reflex'.)

.

[riffclown]

My original Reflex (pictured above and here) was one of the Earlier runs run.  They may have made modifications later. When I sold mine the new owner noticed one of the vinyl "sleeves" I placed on it had split and did the pictured work. Except for the "black sleeve in the pic above., this is how the earlier runs of Reflex kites came fitted.

Stock configuration (Prior to the mod) is pictured here

FWIW, I was an early adopter, Mine was also an early secondary market item.. It wasn't for me. The float isn't what I was looking for.

My first review of this kite

And documentation on the Mod by @SHBKF

 

[Buellbloke]

1 minute ago, midibot said:

Got it.

But the spring has been (re)attached - or reinforced - with heat shrink, yes?

And it looks like you have some on the spring itself.  Or some kind of tubing.  (The newish one I am examining as we speak is bare wire, held on with some kind of tape-like stuff labelled 'Reflex'.)

.

I realise your after Riffclowns attention but guess your spring your currently inspecting probably came before mine? Just spotted the darker section of wire on the spring as you posted it.

[midibot]

17 minutes ago, Buellbloke said:

I realise your after Riffclowns attention but guess your spring your currently inspecting probably came before mine? Just spotted the darker section of wire on the spring as you posted it.

Ahh, but your query gave rise to my interest so thanks for that.

Here's a pic of my spring. Kite was new for my wife last Christmas but cannot vouch for how old it is model-wise. It may have been old stock at my vendor...?

Kite is labelled as a 'Rev 1.5 Classic' fwiw -- Reflex as can be seen.

Hope this works:

[Buellbloke]

46 minutes ago, riffclown said:

Actually I didn't use Heat Shrink when I did mine originally..

Midibot is on about the way the spring is attached to the tube, we each have 3 different offerings. I like the heatshrunk way as it looks stronger and tidier.