makatakam

I hear John say "It's so slow....." . I guess compared to his flying style it is VERY slow. Compared to 30-foot lines it seems as if an eternity passes between input and reaction. I realize that phrasing it that way is a huge exaggeration, but the difference is definitely remarkable. Your last sentence is probably the best description of the difference. You could even say "forced to be graceful".

If I had a dollar for every time I heard that one out on the field, I could buy a round of drinks. I usually tell them that the wind is too variable in that spot to fly with any stability, and they buy it hook, line and sinker. It really makes me want to laugh out loud, but that would be quite rude, so I wait until they are out of earshot. Then I go into ROFLMAO mode.

Hi, Scott, and welcome to the forum. It's good to have you on board. Before you buy a UL or SUL kite, check in with the flyers here. Some will suit your style better than others. The experienced dual-line pilots here can save you some time and grief (intentional Charlie Brown reference).

101.7 Hazardous operations. (a) No person may operate any moored balloon, kite, unmanned rocket, or unmanned free balloon in a manner that creates a hazard to other persons, or their property. That includes anywhere. 5 miles or 50 miles. If someone complains or is injured -- guilty. This is from the FAA kite regulations, and although there is no mention of distance from an airport, it's that "creates a hazard" part that will put you in hot water. If there are no problems you didn't create a hazard. As soon as someone complains . . . . . . . .

I believe that the FAA regulations prohibit flying within 5 miles of any airport, without obtaining permission for a specific location in advance, each time you fly. Personally, I wouldn't fly in any place on the map shown, unless they asked me to for some reason. It appears to be less than a mile in any direction. Wouldn't want the liability involved in being that close. I frequently fly at Meineke Park about a block from my house. It is about 4 miles away from Schaumburg Municipal Airport. There have been occasions when a plane or helicopter has flown over at less than 500 feet. Not an issue with a sport kite on 120-foot lines. If I had been flying a 12-foot SLK delta at 400 feet, it could be dangerous. IMHO, it's not worth the chance. There are other places to fly that are as good or better.

Oh, yeah. If you ever get the chance to try 240's, do it. It's like the whole world got put on slo-mo. You give the kite some input, and it thinks about it for a minute, and then responds. Weird and fascinating. Side slides become a week-long event.

Yeah, the right kite for current conditions = priceless!

If you find yourself over-controlling your Zen and flipping a wing when backing up, you can use shorter handles, and/or move your grip down a couple of inches on the handles. A shorter lever on the bottom will lessen the amount of input. Also a good strategy for any kite in strong wind. With experience you will lose the tendency to give the kite too much input. Hang in there. It will come with time on the lines.

Congratulations, GammoRay.

There's videos on YouTube. I know people who have flown it and they say it flies well, quite similar to a Rev, but with its own distinct flavor -- whatever that means. From the videos I've seen it appears to be quite precise. Of course most of the videos I've seen are ones in which Lam is flying the kite, and he's no slouch at any quad. I think it may be pricey + overseas shipping.

Hi, fg, and welcome to the forum. I look forward to sharing a field with you someday. Knoxville area?

Exactly! I really, really like a bit higher aspect ratio in an SUL. The additional speed keeps it moving and makes up for the missing amount of mass. If only I could design one that doesn't involve this compromise.........

You can also change how much it "talks" by changing the lengths of bridle legs to shift the overall location of the bridle vertically, changing its width from side to side, or just changing the length of the center leg of the bridle on the LE. I will usually make an adjustable bridle on scratch made kites so I can play with bridle positioning as I test fly. Once I am satisfied that I have found the sweet spot, I build a more permanent one. On some, I leave that center leg adjustable, especially the really SUL ones.

Safety first, always. When you ignore it, it will bite you. If you don't feel conditions are safe, pack your stuff and leave. Mention it to the others. They will either listen or laugh. Either way, you did what was right. Let them pay for the consequence of their actions. It's good to have fliers like you on the field. Someone should always act as the "Safety Gauge".

Don't take it too seriously and worry too much about how well you do. Remember, it's only kites. Kites are for having fun. Have fun first, and if you win that's even more fun.

No price or availability when I looked today. Don't forget that lines, if new, will set you back $75 to $100. Look for an RTF (Ready To Fly) package deal. It's the best value for the money. Keep an eye on eBay. Used ones from people who didn't get into it show up frequently, and many that have just been taking up space in the garage for the last 10 years. Take your time. I know how much you want to get into it, but it will cost you twice as much as it should have if you make hasty decisions. Show up at the kite lot some more and get to know the others. Ask around. Many Rev fliers have kites that just sit in their bag taking up space. On the field is where you find the best deals. Go to a festival. Haggle with the kite retailer(s) present at the event. They always seem to be more generous on the field than back at the store.

Hi, Helkbird, and welcome to the forum. @bbailey49 is right in the Knoxville area. You can send him a PM, or just hang loose and he'll probably pop in here. I don't know much about the Volksquad, since the only time I have ever seen one was on display in a kite shop and in videos. I have heard that it flies well, but its flight characteristics are different than a Rev's. They are sold by New Tech Kites (NTK) and they should have replacement parts available. If you check with some of the kite shops across the country you may be able to find parts also.

Yep, midvent with 3-wrap, or green race rods should do nicely. I just came from the new member intro section and saw you got to fly with Dragonfish. Good going. You should be on track now to choose wisely.

I'm glad you could get out there with Dragonfish and get some idea of what Revs are like. You WILL make some hard contact with the ground as you learn so keep that in mind as you acquire your Rev. You should now be able to make a more informed choice. If you have any questions, shoot. We'll all do our best to help. 10mph and up is midvent to full vent territory, depending on experience and wind quality. I recommend starting with a midvent if you are sure you will ignore wind that's 10mph or less. If you think you may do some flying in wind less than that, then you should start with a standard sail, and get a full vent as your second kite when you are ready for it. As I said, ask all the questions you need to. We don't bite.

It can be tough finding others in your area. Keep posting; sooner or later someone will join you. Or you could just get someone you know to join you and get that person hooked. Devious counts.

I usually go N+2, so when one wears out . . . . .

Oh, and by the way, UL does stand for UltraLight. SUL=SuperUltraLight. SLE=SuperLeadingEdge. STD=Standard (or SexuallyTransmittedDisease, depending who you listen to). MID=Midvent. VTD=Vented (aka, full vent). EV=ExtraVented. Vicki=basically all vent, very little sail material (primarily used in howling winds) OPK=OtherPeoplesKites (what you fly before you buy). GMDHD=GimMeDatHotDog (just checking if you're paying attention). LPG=LaserProGold (line made of spectra fiber that most people use for quads). SS=Shanti Skybond, another premium line that plays well with others, fluorescent yellow in color. NSH=NoSnagHandles (this anagram is not used very often, but I've seen it a couple of times). I am not familiar with Shanti Warp Speed line. Quadline kite line, when new, should feel slick like Teflon, not waxy like dental floss, or rough like hemp rope. If it ain't slick, don't buy or use it. Again, it is one of those things that will cause you grief. Other terminology that will become more meaningful as you gain experience: Hybrid Frame=mixing different tube strenghts in the LE, or LE and uprights, to induce quicker or slower response to and from a loaded sail. Response time=the relative amount of time it takes a frame member to return from flexed to straight, key to proper sail loading. Sail Loading=filling the sail with enough wind pressure to create the airfoil shape the sail requires to create lift. This is only the beginning, grasshopper. Depending on how involved you get and your level of obsession, you will become familiar with all, some, or none of the terminology. I have brought people into quad kiting who are perfectly content with just cruising around with the kite under control, and only being familiar with the basic moves. Others, like JB=JohnBarresi, are creating new terminology and moves each year. Wherever you fit in is exactly right for you, as long as you have fun, smile, and don't forget to breathe. P.S. -- Don't overthink what you're doing. Feel what the kite is doing. Feel the wind pressure on the sail. Stay relaxed, take frequent breaks.

I started with an SLE standard sail, and still have it and fly it occasionally. In the eight years since that first kite I have acquired 13 other Revs, including some Speed Series, a full set of B-Pros including a matching Zen, an indoor Rev, Rev II, etc. I have also made some. My quiver holds about 20 Rev and Rev-like quads, and I find the right conditions each year to make each kite the right choice for that day. The SLE leading edge is larger diameter and very strong and stiff, which allows you to fly in strong winds, but strong winds will stretch the sail prematurely. Most experienced pilots seldom use them and jokingly refer to them as "tomato stakes", but they will handle wind which would immediately snap a 3-wrap frame.You will, if you stay in kite flying, eventually end up with at least three kites to handle what Mother Nature throws at you, that will allow you to fly comfortably in wind from 2 to 30 mph. If it's blowing faster than 30, have a beer instead. Seriously, even if you have to drive 4 hours one way, do it at least once. There's a bunch of flyers in New York state area. If you get a chance to be in the area some time, look one of them up by posting up on this forum, and one of them will probably respond.

Hi, Phil, and welcome. I hope we can cross lines someday. The first and most important thing you must know is that there is no such thing as a perfect kite. Each one is a compromise of various design elements tailored to fit a specific range of conditions. We all keep buying new and more, looking for that "perfect" design. It does not exist, and probably never will. If you don't believe this, you spend thousands of dollars and hours to prove it to yourself. Now that you have all the basic information that you'll ever need, we can get down to business. Which kite you buy depends entirely on the depth of your pockets. You can start with a thousand-dollar kite or a hundred-dollar kite. It will make no difference in the way the kite feels or flies for at least the first 100 hours, possibly many more, when you are learning the basics. Keep in mind that you WILL put an excess amount of wear on the kite you learn with, not enough to kill it, but noticeable. For this reason many beginners start with a used or otherwise inexpensive kite that they can beat up pretty well without worrying about it. You should concentrate on flying, instead of possible damage. Your first quad, unless you mostly have wind more than 15-mph in your area, should be a full sail. You will eventually seek out vented models that will expand the range of conditions in which you can fly. A standard (full) sail can be flown by an experienced pilot in wind from 2 to 20 mph, although wind over 15 makes it more work than fun. Your range at the beginning will be 6-12 mph, and will expand with time on the lines. This will be your "comfort zone" where you will actually be improving your skills, instead of fighting the wind. The differences among the different models do not make one better than another, they only give each one different flight characteristics, which eventually you may like or not like. That's why starting out with something very basic (inexpensive also) like an EXP is a good decision. Once you have enough experience to appreciate the different flight characteristics of the available models (and sizes) you will be able to make an informed choice. Stay with the 1.5 format for your first sail. Definitely get to some kite festivals and talk with the people flying their Revs and check some out. I would say, IMHO, That a 3-hour drive to get to one is well worth your time. You may even find someone who has one he can sell to you. Experienced guidance can save you many hours of frustration, and illustrate some of the little "tricks" that become second-hand, intuitive things with time. Whatever you do, remember that kite flying is meant to be fun. Be safe. Stay away from trees, power lines, buildings and people. Most importantly, have fun, smile, and don't forget to breathe.